Fwd: Re: [NCUC-DISCUSS] Some comments on WGIG nominees

[Carlos Afonso]

MIlton, unfortunately I am one of the "usual suspects" in our region. Since I
believe, as I said, that the final choice will be by WG "inner
circle" (UN/ITU I guess), I am not sure we should spend more energy on
discussing nominations, and I would suggest that the latest version of the
suggestions' list just be sent Markus, and let us move on to other issues.

--c.a.

Em Tuesday 24 August 2004 12:32, Milton Mueller escreveu:
> Carlos:
>
> First, don't forget to use "reply all" if you respond to this ;-)
>
> Second, more interesting to me than your belief that Bill
> is smart (which does not really respond to the concerns that
> were raised about him) is the question of your own status,
> or the status of other Latin Americans who might be suitable
> for the WGIG. Are you interested in this position, are there
> others from the region, other than the "usual suspects,"
> whose names might be put forward?
>
> --MM
>
> >>> "carlos a. afonso" <ca at RITS.ORG.BR> 08/23/04 11:35PM >>>
>
> [also intended to go to the list, but sent instead just to Adam -- my
> mistake --c.a.]
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: "carlos a. afonso" <ca at rits.org.br>
> To: "Adam Peake" <ajp at GLOCOM.AC.JP>
> Date: Sun, 22 Aug 2004 12:17:48 -0300
> Subject: Re: [NCUC-DISCUSS] Some comments on WGIG nominees
>
> Well, I feel like I am a more stringent critic than Bill regarding the
> whole ICANN structure (hard for me to say and swallow the inevitable
> truth: we do not have another one to look forward to at this point, so
> let us try and work inside it but anchored on a strong political
> guidance from the outside ot it).
>
> I have had the opportunity to work with Bill in the context of an SSRC
> program (one of the most brilliant fellows I ever met), and I must
> agree
> with Adam here, but, again, let us make sure we follow a fully open
> procedure for a suggested names' list.
>
> I would not dare calling it nomination, since the WG will in essence
> decide "internally" who will be able to join the group, as I grasped
> from three meetings with Markus in KL (we could not stand each other
> anymore ::))).
>
> fraternal rgds
>
> --c.a.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Adam Peake <ajp at GLOCOM.AC.JP>
> To: NCUC-DISCUSS at LISTSERV.SYR.EDU
> Date: Sun, 22 Aug 2004 13:46:30 +0900
> Subject: Re: [NCUC-DISCUSS] Some comments on WGIG nominees
>
> > Actually, I was trying to make a different point when I mentioned
> > Paul, Bill, Susan, etc.  Anyway...
> >
> > >>Bill Drake (who has made v. important contributions to WSIS civil
> > >>society on ICT governance, understands the ICT for development
> > >>aspects
> > >
> > >I know Bill well. He is part of my world, an academic political
> > >scientist
> > >with a good knowledge of global governance processes. His strength
> > >is in traditional telecom institutions like ITU and trade in
> >
> > telecomm
> >
> > >services
> > >in the WTO. "ICT for development" has never been one of his
>
> research
>
> > >areas and he doesn't spend time in developing countries, so don't
> > >oversell
> > >him there Adam. He is smart and creative and would be very vocal.
>
> He
>
> > is
> >
> > >just as undiplomatic as Karl Auerbach, he is reknowned for his
> > >directness.
> > >(Might be interesting for Adam to explain the double standard
>
> here.)
>
> > I find Bill to be diplomatic, and anyone who has seen him work in
> > WSIS would agree. And I really do object to everything been turned
>
> to
>
> > personal attack "Adam to explain the double standard here."
> >
> > Stop it.
> >
> > >I have two problems with Bill. One is that he has had real trouble
> > >grasping
> > >and accepting the importance of ICANN as a governance model,
> > >and the importance of the ICANN issue in the creation of the WGIG.
> > >He has never attended an ICANN meeting, and his technical knowledge
> > >of Internet is weak. As late as December 2003 he was insisting that
> > >the WSIS Internet Governance Caucus rename itself the "Global ICT
> > >Governance" caucus because Internet governance was so "narrow and
> > >unimportant."
> > >
> > >The other is that I think the other two No. American nominees are
> > >preferable. I think that Susan Crawford has given much more thought
> > >to the broad range of IG issues, and that Pam Samuelson
> > >has a much better grasp of the central IPR issues, and so would
> >
> > prefer
> >
> > >the other names for North America over him. But I would not
>
> consider
>
> > >him
> > >unacceptable.
> >
> > This is a very unfair and inaccurate description of Bill Drake's
>
> work
>
> > generally, and work in WSIS specifically (out of context as usual.)
> > It's all public record and I hope we will not see selective quoting
> > to try and distort that record.
> >
> > This is a very good example of why the "winnowing process" must be
> > done in public, not the private method suggested. Too often we are
> > not able to be impartial when personalities are involved.
> >
> > Thanks,
> >
> > Adam
> >
> > >Re: Pindar Wong - I am surprised to see him nominated by Norbert.
> > >Pindar is a very smart man. He pioneered the ISP industry in Hong
> > >Kong (and cleverly sold off the business just before the rush
> > >of competition made it unprofitable). He was an ICANN Board
> > >member appointed by the ASO. He was a key figure in the formation
> > >of the Asia Internet Association, an ISP trade association. Pindar
> >
> > is
> >
> > >the consummate insider. He fulfills all the criteria that Adam
> >
> > thinks
> >
> > >Karl
> > >Auerbach doesn't have: he won't rock the boat, he will be
> >
> > diplomatic,
> >
> > >he will make insider deals. The problem is, there is no real nexus
> >
> > with
> >
> > >the values and principles of this constituency. I've known him and
> > >watched
> > >him for years and I don't know what he believes on policy issues;
>
> he
>
> > >seems
> > >to be a pure pragmatist. He is a businessman. He has personal
> > >integrity. But
> > >I do not see how he can be expected to represent or give voice to
> >
> > the
> >
> > >values
> > >and policies favored by civil society in a global process. And I
> >
> > don't
> >
> > >think
> > >he would be answerable to civil society; I think his identity as a
> > >businessman
> > >and insider would override other considerations, although I do
>
> think
>
> > he
> >
> > >would
> > >make an effort to communicate with us.
> > >
> > >--MM

--
Carlos A. Afonso
diretor de planejamento e estratégia
Rits - Rede de Informações para o Terceiro Setor
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22270-060 Rio de Janeiro BRASIL
telefone +55-21-2527-5494
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