[NCUC-EC] Report from NCUC issue forum

Hfaiedh Ines hfaiedh.ines2 at gmail.com
Wed Dec 20 03:43:27 CET 2023 

I agree as well. Clear procedure needed for next time.

On Wed, Dec 20, 2023, 00:50 Amin Hacha <aminhacha at gmail.com> wrote:

> Hi Benjamin, I support the commitment by honoring the invoice and
> establishing a clear procedure for future payment processes.
>
> On Tue, Dec 19, 2023 at 5:44 PM Benjamin Akinmoyeje <benakin at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> Dear Mili,
>> Apologies for the late response. I have been traveling and with limited
>> time to review this issue.
>>
>> My take on this was to get the invoice at least reviewed downward a bit
>> and I did not see any movement in that direction.
>>
>> There is no transaction beyond negotiation, this is service, we did not
>> sign any agreement, and since a member has raised concerns I expected some
>> consideration of good faith from you.
>>
>> However, we have missed two EC meetings to discuss and iron out this
>> issue. This is a learning moment and I hope in the future we can handle
>> issues like this better.
>>
>> Moving forward,  I would call for ECs to indicate their approval for the
>> invoice and we can finalize the issue so that the treasury can honor the
>> invoice.
>>
>>
>> Kind regards,
>> Benjamin
>>
>> On Tue, Dec 19, 2023 at 3:41 PM Mili <milisemlani at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Hello Milton,
>>>    I would like to bring to your notice the pending invoice payment for
>>> the report of the issue forum held at Hamburg.
>>>
>>> The report has been received and the invoice was sent more than a month
>>> ago. The writer has been following up with me to know when it will be paid.
>>>
>>> I have checked in with Benjamin a couple of times already but I have not
>>> received an answer.  As per our last EC monthly meeting, all the EC members
>>> on the call agreed to honoring the invoice at the earliest.
>>>
>>> May I know what is the mechanism to ensure it is paid before the end of
>>> the year? And if there is anything you need us to do to speed this up?
>>>
>>> --
>>> With gratitude
>>> Mili Semlani
>>> Journalist & Engagement Manager
>>> Founder @ Youth4IG <http://youth4ig.asia/>
>>> Instagram <https://www.instagram.com/theuntraveller/> | LinkedIn
>>> <https://www.linkedin.com/in/milisemlani/>
>>>
>>> On Dec 18, 2023, at 11:45, Mili <milisemlani at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> Hi Benjamin
>>>    What is the update on the invoice status? It is getting very
>>> difficult for me to hold the writer any further.
>>>
>>> I appreciate a quick response and hope we have already taken the
>>> necessary action.
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> With gratitude
>>> Mili Semlani
>>> Journalist & Engagement Manager
>>> Founder @ Youth4IG <http://youth4ig.asia/>
>>> Instagram <https://www.instagram.com/theuntraveller/> | LinkedIn
>>> <https://www.linkedin.com/in/milisemlani/>
>>>
>>> On Dec 11, 2023, at 21:05, Mili <milisemlani at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> Hi
>>>    As need to settle this asap and unfortunately, we could not fully
>>> discuss it over the EC call today as Benjamin was unable to connect.
>>>
>>> As discussed on the call, most EC members acknowledge that we need
>>> better guidelines to manage such tasks in the future but that is a separate
>>> matter and an internal one.
>>>
>>> It does not require holding up the invoice. As we should honor what we
>>> need to. In keeping with that conversation, if any EC member has any
>>> objection to settling this invoice they need to respond to this email by
>>> tomorrow Tues Dec 11. If not, it will be considered as approved and the
>>> Chair should facilitate the payment at the earliest.
>>>
>>> --
>>> With gratitude
>>> Mili Semlani
>>> Journalist & Engagement Manager
>>> Founder @ Youth4IG <http://youth4ig.asia/>
>>> Instagram <https://www.instagram.com/theuntraveller/> | LinkedIn
>>> <https://www.linkedin.com/in/milisemlani/>
>>>
>>> On Nov 28, 2023, at 22:19, Mili Semlani <milisemlani at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> 
>>> Hi Benjamin
>>>   As mentioned in my earlier email, there is no way to negotiate the
>>> amount after we have commissioned the article. As far as I remember, the
>>> in-person meeting in Hamburg where we finalised the rapporteur task did not
>>> have any discussion about the costs involved. Ken and Oksana who were also
>>> in this respective meeting held on Day 0 of ICANN78 can confirm what they
>>> recall from this discussion.
>>>
>>> At my workplace, on average, we pay US$100-150 for content marketing
>>> articles that are often based on rehashing online content and US$250-300
>>> for well-researched articles, event coverage and reports. Now that the
>>> report has already been drafted, there is no way for us to negotiate or
>>> change the payment terms. We assigned the report a day before the actual
>>> event and we had very little time to advertise for a rapporteur; I had to
>>> reach out to the writers I have a working relationship with and given the
>>> short notice, the price quoted by them is something I had to agree with to
>>> get the job done.
>>>
>>> I don't think we are in a position to decide whether we should process
>>> this invoice or not. It is too late for that. The one thing we should learn
>>> from this is that we need to plan such tasks and the budgets around them a
>>> lot better. I urge you to do the needful here as soon as possible, and
>>> kindly understand that my work ethic and relationship with the external
>>> vendor are at stake here.
>>>
>>> As mentioned earlier, I would like to excuse myself from any tasks or
>>> responsibilities that include financial transactions on behalf of NCUC; in
>>> the future. Rest assured, as an active member and EC member; I will be
>>> happy to help with any other tasks that suit my skills and time
>>> commitments.
>>> --
>>> With gratitude
>>> *Mili Semlani*
>>> Community specialist
>>> Instagram <https://www.instagram.com/theuntraveller/> | LinkedIn
>>> <https://www.linkedin.com/in/milisemlani/>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Tue, 28 Nov 2023 at 20:34, Benjamin Akinmoyeje <benakin at gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Dear Mili,
>>>> Good day and I hope your week started well. Here is an email I sent to
>>>> you previously on the invoice.
>>>>
>>>> The verbal conversation we had estimated a lower cost than what is
>>>> presented and that is what I am comfortable proceeding with.
>>>>
>>>> Kind regards,
>>>> Benjamin
>>>>
>>>> ---------- Forwarded message ---------
>>>> From: Benjamin Akinmoyeje <benakin at gmail.com>
>>>> Date: Thu, Nov 16, 2023 at 11:54 AM
>>>> Subject: Re: [NCUC-EC] Report from NCUC issue forum
>>>> To: Mili Semlani <milisemlani at gmail.com>
>>>> Cc: Kathy Kleiman <kathy at dnrc.tech>, Exec. Comm <ncuc-ec at lists.ncuc.org
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Dear Mili,
>>>> Thank you very much for the invoice; however, I have a little challenge
>>>> with the invoice. If my memory serves me correctly, our discussion about
>>>> the service cost was supposed to be a token, probably within the range of
>>>> 100 - 150 USD.
>>>>
>>>> Paying up to 300 USD for a service that already raised some concerns
>>>> would require more protocols or due process.
>>>>
>>>> I recommend that the writer review the invoice to make it easier for us
>>>> to approve.
>>>> Thank you for the facilitation and support on this work.
>>>>
>>>> Kind regards,
>>>> Benjamin
>>>>
>>>> On Thu, Nov 16, 2023 at 9:41 AM Mili Semlani <milisemlani at gmail.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Hi all
>>>>>
>>>>> Attached is the invoice for the issue report. As per the usual terms
>>>>> (given my experience working with them for my day job), we need to pay them
>>>>> within 30 days of commissioning the assignment. After which we have full
>>>>> right to use the report and publish it anywhere. We are not required to
>>>>> give them any byline or credit.
>>>>> --
>>>>> With gratitude
>>>>> *Mili Semlani*
>>>>> Community specialist
>>>>> Instagram <https://www.instagram.com/theuntraveller/> | LinkedIn
>>>>> <https://www.linkedin.com/in/milisemlani/>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Wed, 15 Nov 2023 at 20:46, Benjamin Akinmoyeje <benakin at gmail.com>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>   Dear Kathy,
>>>>>> Thank you for your response. In requesting support from PIR, this was
>>>>>> the list.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> PIR Support Request:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ●     Provide financial support to get a photographer, refreshments,
>>>>>> and rapporteurs for the event.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ●     PIR’s financial support will help support logistical issues
>>>>>> for after-event gatherings.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> You can see the extract from the attached document. I did not say
>>>>>> Mili would know how much was promised, the invoice that would be submitted
>>>>>> will indicate. It should be a token because that was what was agreed upon
>>>>>> by the EC. The process of searching for a rapporteur appeared to be
>>>>>> time-limited; hence we got the option of outsourcing to an online service.
>>>>>> And Mili committed to helping out with that.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The last NCUC issue forum did not have a report; we were fortunate to
>>>>>> use Prof Milton's blog as evidence of the event.  This time, my solution to
>>>>>> that was to ensure there was provision.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> No one has been paid, and I do not have any invoice to know how much
>>>>>> that would be paid.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The bylaws do not permit me to handle NCUC finance individually or
>>>>>> any funding approval, or disbursement, and the NCUC EC would have discussed
>>>>>> this at our monthly meeting. Still, Mili could not make it because of
>>>>>> the official religious holiday of Diwali. The NCUC EC would have to discuss
>>>>>> and approve the invoice and the payment whenever the invoice is submitted.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I will wait for Mili to facilitate the process of getting the report
>>>>>> writer to submit the invoice and the ECs accept and approve the cost as
>>>>>> directed by NCUC operating procedures.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Also, find attached the full proposal submitted to PIR.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Kind regards,
>>>>>> Benjamin
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Fri, Nov 3, 2023 at 4:30 AM Mili <milisemlani at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Dear Kathy
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>   Thanks for your questions.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I would direct these questions to @benjamin and @ Milton who will be
>>>>>>> better suited to answer anything related to the finances.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> As of now the payment has not been made. Once the final draft is
>>>>>>> shared, we will receive the invoice.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Once the invoice is honored, NCUC/SG will own all rights to the
>>>>>>> report. As a standard in the publishing world. We (by we I mean NCUC/SG
>>>>>>> here) are free to share, publish and circulate it as we please.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I am merely carrying this facilitation as an NCUC volunteer in my
>>>>>>> capacity as the EC member.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> With gratitude
>>>>>>> Mili Semlani
>>>>>>> Journalist & Engagement Manager
>>>>>>> Founder @ Youth4IG <http://youth4ig.asia/>
>>>>>>> Instagram <https://www.instagram.com/theuntraveller/> | LinkedIn
>>>>>>> <https://www.linkedin.com/in/milisemlani/>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Nov 3, 2023, at 01:49, Kathy Kleiman <kathy at dnrc.tech> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Tx Mili, thanks for your response and agreed that it takes a lot of
>>>>>>> work to make a forum happen.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Let me follow-up with two quick questions. Could you share the
>>>>>>> source of the funds (was this PIR money?) and how much you paid?  Also who
>>>>>>> owns the report this group produced?  These seem like fair questions, but
>>>>>>> if there is a concern about transparency, please let me know.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Best regards, Kathy
>>>>>>> On 11/2/2023 10:40 AM, Mili wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Hi Kathy
>>>>>>>   As mentioned in my earlier emails too, we hired a rapporteur (a
>>>>>>> writing agency that has writers) to prepare this report for us.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> For everyone’s clarity, I did not write the report. I am merely
>>>>>>> facilitating it as we divided the various tasks for the issue forum and I
>>>>>>> took over the task of looking for a rapporteur and co ordinating this.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> And yes everyone put in a lot of work to make the issue forum happen
>>>>>>> and it’s great to see the collective result of all our efforts.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> With gratitude
>>>>>>> Mili Semlani
>>>>>>> Journalist & Engagement Manager
>>>>>>> Founder @ Youth4IG <http://youth4ig.asia/>
>>>>>>> Instagram <https://www.instagram.com/theuntraveller/> | LinkedIn
>>>>>>> <https://www.linkedin.com/in/milisemlani/>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Nov 2, 2023, at 19:56, Kathy Kleiman <kathy at dnrc.tech>
>>>>>>> <kathy at dnrc.tech> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Hi Mili,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> A lot of people spent a lot of time preparing for this issues forum
>>>>>>> (as well as the first).  Can I ask how much you got paid to write this
>>>>>>> report (and how  long it took)?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Best and thanks,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Kathy
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 11/2/2023 2:13 AM, Mili Semlani wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Hi
>>>>>>>   As a part of the 20th anniversary celebration, we organised an
>>>>>>> issue forum at ICANN78. It was decided that we hire a rapporteur to prepare
>>>>>>> a brief report of the discussion.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I have attached the first draft of the report they have sent me.
>>>>>>> Kindly take a look and let me know if it's okay (check for factual errors,
>>>>>>> if its readable well and detailed enough for us).
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Can we add a link to the comparison between At large and NCSG
>>>>>>> applicant support proposals (the printed version that you prepared and
>>>>>>> circulated at the session) to this report? If yes, please share the link or
>>>>>>> send the document as an attachment.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Also let me know if there is any other feedback on the attached
>>>>>>> report, changes, amendments etc. We ideally should share and publish it for
>>>>>>> our members before the readout scheduled for Nov 6.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> With gratitude
>>>>>>> *Mili Semlani*
>>>>>>> Community specialist
>>>>>>> Instagram <https://www.instagram.com/theuntraveller/> | LinkedIn
>>>>>>> <https://www.linkedin.com/in/milisemlani/>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Thu, 2 Nov 2023 at 01:59, Kathy Kleiman <kathy at dnrc.tech>
>>>>>>> <kathy at dnrc.tech> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Hi Mili,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Good to see you and Hamburg, and nice to have a chance to talk.
>>>>>>>> Still in catch-up mode here; I'll have things over to you  tomorrow (11/2).
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Also, what is a soft copy for and who is the writer?  Not sure I
>>>>>>>> understand the request...
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Best, Kathy
>>>>>>>> On 11/1/2023 11:14 AM, Mili wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Noted. @milton do you have any additional resources, links that
>>>>>>>> point to this?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> @kathy maybe we can also attach the comparison between At large and
>>>>>>>> NCSG applicant support proposals (the printed version that you prepared and
>>>>>>>> circulated at the session). Can you also send me a soft copy for the same
>>>>>>>> so I can share it with the writer to incorporate.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> @all of no further comments, I will send this with the below
>>>>>>>> feedback for final drafting. Kindly let me know by EOD (Nov 1).
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>> With gratitude
>>>>>>>> Mili Semlani
>>>>>>>> Journalist & Engagement Manager
>>>>>>>> Founder @ Youth4IG <http://youth4ig.asia/>
>>>>>>>> Instagram <https://www.instagram.com/theuntraveller/> | LinkedIn
>>>>>>>> <https://www.linkedin.com/in/milisemlani/>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Nov 1, 2023, at 00:37, Mueller, Milton L <milton at gatech.edu>
>>>>>>>> <milton at gatech.edu> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Hello, Mili
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I think the report on RVCs would be improved if we could attach the
>>>>>>>> framework Kathy and I developed for allowable RVCs. It could also discuss
>>>>>>>> some of the “stress test” studies we discussed.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> *From:* NCUC-EC <ncuc-ec-bounces at lists.ncuc.org>
>>>>>>>> <ncuc-ec-bounces at lists.ncuc.org> *On Behalf Of *Mili Semlani
>>>>>>>> *Sent:* Tuesday, October 31, 2023 6:31 AM
>>>>>>>> *To:* Exec. Comm <ncuc-ec at lists.ncuc.org> <ncuc-ec at lists.ncuc.org>
>>>>>>>> *Subject:* [NCUC-EC] Report from NCUC issue forum
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Hello all
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>   As a part of the 20th anniversary celebration, we organised an
>>>>>>>> issue forum at ICANN78. It was decided that we hire a rapporteur to prepare
>>>>>>>> a brief report of the discussion.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I have attached the first draft of the report they have sent me.
>>>>>>>> Kindly take a look and let me know if it's okay (check for factual errors,
>>>>>>>> if its readable well and detailed enough for us). If it's good to go and
>>>>>>>> doesn't require any changes, we can furnish their invoice and they will
>>>>>>>> pass the rights for us to publish this report.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> With gratitude
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> *Mili Semlani*
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Community specialist
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Instagram <https://www.instagram.com/theuntraveller/> | LinkedIn
>>>>>>>> <https://www.linkedin.com/in/milisemlani/>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>> Kathy Kleiman
>>>>>>>> President, Domain Name Rights Coalition
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> Kathy Kleiman
>>>>>>> President, Domain Name Rights Coalition
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> Kathy Kleiman
>>>>>>> President, Domain Name Rights Coalition
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> NCUC-EC mailing list
>>>>>>> NCUC-EC at lists.ncuc.org
>>>>>>> https://lists.ncuc.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/ncuc-ec
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>> NCUC-EC at lists.ncuc.org
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>>
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