[NCUC-EC] Report from NCUC issue forum

Wed Dec 20 00:49:36 CET 2023

 Hi Benjamin, I support the commitment by honoring the invoice and
establishing a clear procedure for future payment processes.

On Tue, Dec 19, 2023 at 5:44 PM Benjamin Akinmoyeje <benakin at gmail.com>
wrote:

> Dear Mili,
> Apologies for the late response. I have been traveling and with limited
> time to review this issue.
>
> My take on this was to get the invoice at least reviewed downward a bit
> and I did not see any movement in that direction.
>
> There is no transaction beyond negotiation, this is service, we did not
> sign any agreement, and since a member has raised concerns I expected some
> consideration of good faith from you.
>
> However, we have missed two EC meetings to discuss and iron out this
> issue. This is a learning moment and I hope in the future we can handle
> issues like this better.
>
> Moving forward,  I would call for ECs to indicate their approval for the
> invoice and we can finalize the issue so that the treasury can honor the
> invoice.
>
>
> Kind regards,
> Benjamin
>
> On Tue, Dec 19, 2023 at 3:41 PM Mili <milisemlani at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Hello Milton,
>>    I would like to bring to your notice the pending invoice payment for
>> the report of the issue forum held at Hamburg.
>>
>> The report has been received and the invoice was sent more than a month
>> ago. The writer has been following up with me to know when it will be paid.
>>
>> I have checked in with Benjamin a couple of times already but I have not
>> received an answer.  As per our last EC monthly meeting, all the EC members
>> on the call agreed to honoring the invoice at the earliest.
>>
>> May I know what is the mechanism to ensure it is paid before the end of
>> the year? And if there is anything you need us to do to speed this up?
>>
>> --
>> With gratitude
>> Mili Semlani
>> Journalist & Engagement Manager
>> Founder @ Youth4IG <http://youth4ig.asia/>
>> Instagram <https://www.instagram.com/theuntraveller/> | LinkedIn
>> <https://www.linkedin.com/in/milisemlani/>
>>
>> On Dec 18, 2023, at 11:45, Mili <milisemlani at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> Hi Benjamin
>>    What is the update on the invoice status? It is getting very difficult
>> for me to hold the writer any further.
>>
>> I appreciate a quick response and hope we have already taken the
>> necessary action.
>>
>>
>> --
>> With gratitude
>> Mili Semlani
>> Journalist & Engagement Manager
>> Founder @ Youth4IG <http://youth4ig.asia/>
>> Instagram <https://www.instagram.com/theuntraveller/> | LinkedIn
>> <https://www.linkedin.com/in/milisemlani/>
>>
>> On Dec 11, 2023, at 21:05, Mili <milisemlani at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> Hi
>>    As need to settle this asap and unfortunately, we could not fully
>> discuss it over the EC call today as Benjamin was unable to connect.
>>
>> As discussed on the call, most EC members acknowledge that we need better
>> guidelines to manage such tasks in the future but that is a separate matter
>> and an internal one.
>>
>> It does not require holding up the invoice. As we should honor what we
>> need to. In keeping with that conversation, if any EC member has any
>> objection to settling this invoice they need to respond to this email by
>> tomorrow Tues Dec 11. If not, it will be considered as approved and the
>> Chair should facilitate the payment at the earliest.
>>
>> --
>> With gratitude
>> Mili Semlani
>> Journalist & Engagement Manager
>> Founder @ Youth4IG <http://youth4ig.asia/>
>> Instagram <https://www.instagram.com/theuntraveller/> | LinkedIn
>> <https://www.linkedin.com/in/milisemlani/>
>>
>> On Nov 28, 2023, at 22:19, Mili Semlani <milisemlani at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> 
>> Hi Benjamin
>>   As mentioned in my earlier email, there is no way to negotiate the
>> amount after we have commissioned the article. As far as I remember, the
>> in-person meeting in Hamburg where we finalised the rapporteur task did not
>> have any discussion about the costs involved. Ken and Oksana who were also
>> in this respective meeting held on Day 0 of ICANN78 can confirm what they
>> recall from this discussion.
>>
>> At my workplace, on average, we pay US$100-150 for content marketing
>> articles that are often based on rehashing online content and US$250-300
>> for well-researched articles, event coverage and reports. Now that the
>> report has already been drafted, there is no way for us to negotiate or
>> change the payment terms. We assigned the report a day before the actual
>> event and we had very little time to advertise for a rapporteur; I had to
>> reach out to the writers I have a working relationship with and given the
>> short notice, the price quoted by them is something I had to agree with to
>> get the job done.
>>
>> I don't think we are in a position to decide whether we should process
>> this invoice or not. It is too late for that. The one thing we should learn
>> from this is that we need to plan such tasks and the budgets around them a
>> lot better. I urge you to do the needful here as soon as possible, and
>> kindly understand that my work ethic and relationship with the external
>> vendor are at stake here.
>>
>> As mentioned earlier, I would like to excuse myself from any tasks or
>> responsibilities that include financial transactions on behalf of NCUC; in
>> the future. Rest assured, as an active member and EC member; I will be
>> happy to help with any other tasks that suit my skills and time
>> commitments.
>> --
>> With gratitude
>> *Mili Semlani*
>> Community specialist
>> Instagram <https://www.instagram.com/theuntraveller/> | LinkedIn
>> <https://www.linkedin.com/in/milisemlani/>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Tue, 28 Nov 2023 at 20:34, Benjamin Akinmoyeje <benakin at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Dear Mili,
>>> Good day and I hope your week started well. Here is an email I sent to
>>> you previously on the invoice.
>>>
>>> The verbal conversation we had estimated a lower cost than what is
>>> presented and that is what I am comfortable proceeding with.
>>>
>>> Kind regards,
>>> Benjamin
>>>
>>> ---------- Forwarded message ---------
>>> From: Benjamin Akinmoyeje <benakin at gmail.com>
>>> Date: Thu, Nov 16, 2023 at 11:54 AM
>>> Subject: Re: [NCUC-EC] Report from NCUC issue forum
>>> To: Mili Semlani <milisemlani at gmail.com>
>>> Cc: Kathy Kleiman <kathy at dnrc.tech>, Exec. Comm <ncuc-ec at lists.ncuc.org>
>>>
>>>
>>> Dear Mili,
>>> Thank you very much for the invoice; however, I have a little challenge
>>> with the invoice. If my memory serves me correctly, our discussion about
>>> the service cost was supposed to be a token, probably within the range of
>>> 100 - 150 USD.
>>>
>>> Paying up to 300 USD for a service that already raised some concerns
>>> would require more protocols or due process.
>>>
>>> I recommend that the writer review the invoice to make it easier for us
>>> to approve.
>>> Thank you for the facilitation and support on this work.
>>>
>>> Kind regards,
>>> Benjamin
>>>
>>> On Thu, Nov 16, 2023 at 9:41 AM Mili Semlani <milisemlani at gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hi all
>>>>
>>>> Attached is the invoice for the issue report. As per the usual terms
>>>> (given my experience working with them for my day job), we need to pay them
>>>> within 30 days of commissioning the assignment. After which we have full
>>>> right to use the report and publish it anywhere. We are not required to
>>>> give them any byline or credit.
>>>> --
>>>> With gratitude
>>>> *Mili Semlani*
>>>> Community specialist
>>>> Instagram <https://www.instagram.com/theuntraveller/> | LinkedIn
>>>> <https://www.linkedin.com/in/milisemlani/>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Wed, 15 Nov 2023 at 20:46, Benjamin Akinmoyeje <benakin at gmail.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>   Dear Kathy,
>>>>> Thank you for your response. In requesting support from PIR, this was
>>>>> the list.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> PIR Support Request:
>>>>>
>>>>> ●     Provide financial support to get a photographer, refreshments,
>>>>> and rapporteurs for the event.
>>>>>
>>>>> ●     PIR’s financial support will help support logistical issues for
>>>>> after-event gatherings.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> You can see the extract from the attached document. I did not say Mili
>>>>> would know how much was promised, the invoice that would be submitted will
>>>>> indicate. It should be a token because that was what was agreed upon by the
>>>>> EC. The process of searching for a rapporteur appeared to be time-limited;
>>>>> hence we got the option of outsourcing to an online service. And Mili
>>>>> committed to helping out with that.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> The last NCUC issue forum did not have a report; we were fortunate to
>>>>> use Prof Milton's blog as evidence of the event.  This time, my solution to
>>>>> that was to ensure there was provision.
>>>>>
>>>>> No one has been paid, and I do not have any invoice to know how much
>>>>> that would be paid.
>>>>>
>>>>> The bylaws do not permit me to handle NCUC finance individually or any
>>>>> funding approval, or disbursement, and the NCUC EC would have discussed
>>>>> this at our monthly meeting. Still, Mili could not make it because of
>>>>> the official religious holiday of Diwali. The NCUC EC would have to discuss
>>>>> and approve the invoice and the payment whenever the invoice is submitted.
>>>>>
>>>>> I will wait for Mili to facilitate the process of getting the report
>>>>> writer to submit the invoice and the ECs accept and approve the cost as
>>>>> directed by NCUC operating procedures.
>>>>>
>>>>> Also, find attached the full proposal submitted to PIR.
>>>>>
>>>>> Kind regards,
>>>>> Benjamin
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Fri, Nov 3, 2023 at 4:30 AM Mili <milisemlani at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Dear Kathy
>>>>>>
>>>>>>   Thanks for your questions.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I would direct these questions to @benjamin and @ Milton who will be
>>>>>> better suited to answer anything related to the finances.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> As of now the payment has not been made. Once the final draft is
>>>>>> shared, we will receive the invoice.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Once the invoice is honored, NCUC/SG will own all rights to the
>>>>>> report. As a standard in the publishing world. We (by we I mean NCUC/SG
>>>>>> here) are free to share, publish and circulate it as we please.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I am merely carrying this facilitation as an NCUC volunteer in my
>>>>>> capacity as the EC member.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> With gratitude
>>>>>> Mili Semlani
>>>>>> Journalist & Engagement Manager
>>>>>> Founder @ Youth4IG <http://youth4ig.asia/>
>>>>>> Instagram <https://www.instagram.com/theuntraveller/> | LinkedIn
>>>>>> <https://www.linkedin.com/in/milisemlani/>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Nov 3, 2023, at 01:49, Kathy Kleiman <kathy at dnrc.tech> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Tx Mili, thanks for your response and agreed that it takes a lot of
>>>>>> work to make a forum happen.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Let me follow-up with two quick questions. Could you share the source
>>>>>> of the funds (was this PIR money?) and how much you paid?  Also who owns
>>>>>> the report this group produced?  These seem like fair questions, but if
>>>>>> there is a concern about transparency, please let me know.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Best regards, Kathy
>>>>>> On 11/2/2023 10:40 AM, Mili wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi Kathy
>>>>>>   As mentioned in my earlier emails too, we hired a rapporteur (a
>>>>>> writing agency that has writers) to prepare this report for us.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> For everyone’s clarity, I did not write the report. I am merely
>>>>>> facilitating it as we divided the various tasks for the issue forum and I
>>>>>> took over the task of looking for a rapporteur and co ordinating this.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> And yes everyone put in a lot of work to make the issue forum happen
>>>>>> and it’s great to see the collective result of all our efforts.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> With gratitude
>>>>>> Mili Semlani
>>>>>> Journalist & Engagement Manager
>>>>>> Founder @ Youth4IG <http://youth4ig.asia/>
>>>>>> Instagram <https://www.instagram.com/theuntraveller/> | LinkedIn
>>>>>> <https://www.linkedin.com/in/milisemlani/>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Nov 2, 2023, at 19:56, Kathy Kleiman <kathy at dnrc.tech>
>>>>>> <kathy at dnrc.tech> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi Mili,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> A lot of people spent a lot of time preparing for this issues forum
>>>>>> (as well as the first).  Can I ask how much you got paid to write this
>>>>>> report (and how  long it took)?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Best and thanks,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Kathy
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On 11/2/2023 2:13 AM, Mili Semlani wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi
>>>>>>   As a part of the 20th anniversary celebration, we organised an
>>>>>> issue forum at ICANN78. It was decided that we hire a rapporteur to prepare
>>>>>> a brief report of the discussion.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I have attached the first draft of the report they have sent me.
>>>>>> Kindly take a look and let me know if it's okay (check for factual errors,
>>>>>> if its readable well and detailed enough for us).
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Can we add a link to the comparison between At large and NCSG
>>>>>> applicant support proposals (the printed version that you prepared and
>>>>>> circulated at the session) to this report? If yes, please share the link or
>>>>>> send the document as an attachment.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Also let me know if there is any other feedback on the attached
>>>>>> report, changes, amendments etc. We ideally should share and publish it for
>>>>>> our members before the readout scheduled for Nov 6.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> With gratitude
>>>>>> *Mili Semlani*
>>>>>> Community specialist
>>>>>> Instagram <https://www.instagram.com/theuntraveller/> | LinkedIn
>>>>>> <https://www.linkedin.com/in/milisemlani/>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Thu, 2 Nov 2023 at 01:59, Kathy Kleiman <kathy at dnrc.tech>
>>>>>> <kathy at dnrc.tech> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Hi Mili,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Good to see you and Hamburg, and nice to have a chance to talk.
>>>>>>> Still in catch-up mode here; I'll have things over to you  tomorrow (11/2).
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Also, what is a soft copy for and who is the writer?  Not sure I
>>>>>>> understand the request...
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Best, Kathy
>>>>>>> On 11/1/2023 11:14 AM, Mili wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Noted. @milton do you have any additional resources, links that
>>>>>>> point to this?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> @kathy maybe we can also attach the comparison between At large and
>>>>>>> NCSG applicant support proposals (the printed version that you prepared and
>>>>>>> circulated at the session). Can you also send me a soft copy for the same
>>>>>>> so I can share it with the writer to incorporate.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> @all of no further comments, I will send this with the below
>>>>>>> feedback for final drafting. Kindly let me know by EOD (Nov 1).
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> With gratitude
>>>>>>> Mili Semlani
>>>>>>> Journalist & Engagement Manager
>>>>>>> Founder @ Youth4IG <http://youth4ig.asia/>
>>>>>>> Instagram <https://www.instagram.com/theuntraveller/> | LinkedIn
>>>>>>> <https://www.linkedin.com/in/milisemlani/>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Nov 1, 2023, at 00:37, Mueller, Milton L <milton at gatech.edu>
>>>>>>> <milton at gatech.edu> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Hello, Mili
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I think the report on RVCs would be improved if we could attach the
>>>>>>> framework Kathy and I developed for allowable RVCs. It could also discuss
>>>>>>> some of the “stress test” studies we discussed.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> *From:* NCUC-EC <ncuc-ec-bounces at lists.ncuc.org>
>>>>>>> <ncuc-ec-bounces at lists.ncuc.org> *On Behalf Of *Mili Semlani
>>>>>>> *Sent:* Tuesday, October 31, 2023 6:31 AM
>>>>>>> *To:* Exec. Comm <ncuc-ec at lists.ncuc.org> <ncuc-ec at lists.ncuc.org>
>>>>>>> *Subject:* [NCUC-EC] Report from NCUC issue forum
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Hello all
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>   As a part of the 20th anniversary celebration, we organised an
>>>>>>> issue forum at ICANN78. It was decided that we hire a rapporteur to prepare
>>>>>>> a brief report of the discussion.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I have attached the first draft of the report they have sent me.
>>>>>>> Kindly take a look and let me know if it's okay (check for factual errors,
>>>>>>> if its readable well and detailed enough for us). If it's good to go and
>>>>>>> doesn't require any changes, we can furnish their invoice and they will
>>>>>>> pass the rights for us to publish this report.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> With gratitude
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> *Mili Semlani*
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Community specialist
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Instagram <https://www.instagram.com/theuntraveller/> | LinkedIn
>>>>>>> <https://www.linkedin.com/in/milisemlani/>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> Kathy Kleiman
>>>>>>> President, Domain Name Rights Coalition
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>> Kathy Kleiman
>>>>>> President, Domain Name Rights Coalition
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> Kathy Kleiman
>>>>>> President, Domain Name Rights Coalition
>>>>>>
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> NCUC-EC mailing list
>>>>>> NCUC-EC at lists.ncuc.org
>>>>>> https://lists.ncuc.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/ncuc-ec
>>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
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> NCUC-EC at lists.ncuc.org
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