[NCUC-DISCUSS] Scope creep and renegade was Re: NCUC Statement on PRISM?

[Seth Johnson]

People are pretty clueless about the fundamental limits of the
international arena.  Rights simply don't have the same standing
there, and governments (via their executive branches, I expect in
probably every case) are the actors that conclude decisions.



On Mon, Oct 28, 2013 at 2:30 AM, Dan Krimm <dan at musicunbound.com> wrote:
> The only way I can make sense of Fadi's actions here (granted I'm not
> expert on all the details because I haven't had time to absorb it all) is
> sort of in the guise of "foreign affairs" and "treaties" if one were to
> compare ICANN to a national government institution.
>
> I see your point that general IG is going to affect ICANN, sure that makes
> sense.  But I don't see ICANN as the *forum* where that is going to happen.
> More like: ICANN would do well to be represented in that forum as such.
>
> In any case, this stuff is not likely to emerge *out of* ICANN in any
> significant institutional manner, so far as I can see (and I wouldn't want
> it to, given ICANN's continuing dirty laundry).
>
> I support these discussions at IGF, etc.  That seems an appropriate
> institutional venue to have them.  And let NCUC members be robustly present
> in force, by all means.  And I have no doubt the rest of ICANN's community
> will be there to the extent they care and allocate the resources.
>
> I just would not feel good about the prospect of *building* World/IG *out
> of* ICANN as an institutional platform.  Not good at all.  Pretty jittery,
> in fact.
>
> Dan
>
>
> --
> Any opinions expressed in this message are those of the author alone and do
> not necessarily reflect any position of the author's employer.
>
>
>
> At 1:37 PM +0800 10/28/13, William Drake wrote:
>>+1  I recognize how the optics might look to folks who feel adamant about
>>ICANN staying within its bounded mandate, but the stuff going on in the
>>larger IG environment affects ICANN's ability to continue to work that
>>mandate, and will do so much more in the future.  With all the other I*
>>orgs getting on board efforts to try to build a coalition to sustain
>>multistakeholderism in the face of multilateralism, I can't really see how
>>Fadi and ICANN could just wash their hands of it and say sorry, you'll
>>have to do the lifting without us, particularly when one of the biggest
>>battles is precisely about "us."
>>
>>Bill
>>
>>
>>On Oct 28, 2013, at 12:59 PM, avri doria
>><<mailto:avri at ella.com>avri at ella.com> wrote:
>>
>>>Hi,
>>>
>>>In terms of legitimacy, isn't one of the topics that needs to be explored
>>>internationalisation of ICANN, and IANA? Isn't that a topic at the top of
>>>the list? That seems to be in scope.
>>>
>>>And the ICANN Board seems to be on-board as Fadi was meeting with a
>>>subset of them (including the Chair) and AC/SO leadership every morning.
>>>I wasn't in the meetings, and don't know who the rep from gnso was since
>>>Jonathan wasn't there, so don't know what the level of buy in was, but I
>>>heard no complaints on the ground.
>>>
>>>So whatever we might say about scope creep Fadi is not being renegade.
>>>
>>>As for scope creep Fadi and the leaders of the other I* seem to be acting
>>>in coordinated faction, so it is within their scope, and would seem to be
>>>in scope for any one of them to act on I*'s behalf in organizational
>>> talks with governments on a meeting planning.
>>>
>>>So, in this case at least, I see no fundamental problem of overreach by
>>>Fadi.  And, whether he fully understand what it means, he seems to be
>>>carrying the banner of multistakeholderism into these discussions.
>>>
>>>So, at least this once, I am not ready to join in Fadi-attack.
>>>
>>>
>>>avri
>>>
>>>Sent from a T-Mobile 4G LTE Device
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>>>
>>
>>
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