[NCSG-Discuss] Closed Generics - a letter together
Kathy Kleiman
kathy at KATHYKLEIMAN.COM
Mon Feb 25 21:24:03 CET 2013
Milton,
Because a domain name is not a Top Level Domain. If we follow your
reasoning, there's no reason to perform extensive Technical, Operational
and Financial Showings/Review of New Registries. We don't examine
registrants, so why should we examine New gTLD Registries?
Clearly, it's because they are fundamentally different. Here's something
I wrote awhile ago -- my thoughts based on my background as both a
Registrant and a Registry:
--------------------
*Why is COMPUTER.COM different from .COMPUTER?*
Given the history of ICANN and our Applicant Guidebook, the answer to
this question follows from the existing gTLD program as we have extended
it into the New gTLD Program. It is the expectation set by our
Community, by the Board and by our New gTLD rules that Registries
register domain names on a non-discriminatory basis to Registrants and
Registrars.
Dot-COM, .ORG and .NET are the public's models for .BOOK, .APP and
.CLOUD. People know that Verisign registers .COM to a wide variety of
companies and businesses. While computer.com is registered to a single
entity, monopolizing its use, the same is not true of the TLD itself.
*/Verisign must operate .COM in a non-discriminatory way -- to
registrants and registrars. That's the essence of being a gTLD Registry. /*
Thus, for the top level and based on our rules, the public expects
generic words such as "com," "biz," "book," "app" and "cloud" to be run
as Registries in the truest sense of the world -- as entities engaged in
the management, operation and security of the TLD -- committed to
registering domain names on a non-discriminatory basis to registrants
and registrars globally.That's a promise set out in the rules. The
public will expect to find the normal array of competitors and
innovators in New gTLDs, just as within existing TLDs.
-------------------------
Best,
Kathy
:
>
> Kristina
>
> It _/is/_ an issue related to censorship, and you are on the wrong
> side of it. You are telling anyone who registers certain kinds of
> words that ICANN and its "community" will be able to dictate what kind
> of content goes under it. You are eliminating a domain owner's
> editorial discretion, even without any claim that there is a monopoly.
>
> Here is a simple way for undecided people to make up their mind on
> this issue in a reasonable way:
>
> We own a generic second-level domain:
>
> *internetgovernance.org ***
>
> Internet governance is a generic term.
>
> Here is a direct challenge to Kathy, Alain, Norbert and Kristina:
> Please tell me why you have a right to register a third-level domain
> under internetgovernance.org. Explain to me why OUR domain should be
> forced to resolve YOUR registrations, which may contain positions we
> don't agree with, which are irrelevant to the purpose of our site, or
> maybe even destructive of it.
>
> If you can't answer that question for my SLD, you can't make the same
> case for a TLD. There is no difference.
>
> I am really looking forward to the kind of explanations I will get. I
> suspect I will get silence, or some rather lame excuses.
>
> *From:*NCSG-Discuss [mailto:NCSG-DISCUSS at LISTSERV.SYR.EDU] *On Behalf
> Of *Kristina Macaulay
> *Sent:* Sunday, February 24, 2013 3:16 PM
> *To:* NCSG-DISCUSS at LISTSERV.SYR.EDU
> *Subject:* Re: [NCSG-Discuss] Closed Generics - a letter together
>
> I'd be happy to contribute or review any statements regarding this
> issue, as I too feel strongly that Closed Generic words must not
> become exclusive or restricted as proposed.
>
> This is a non-commercial issue.
>
> I know it's not related to censorship or copyright, but it has a
> similar notion of precedence of *_exclusive perpetuity_* right over
> something...on this occasion it will be a generic term.
>
> *This MUST never happen!!!!*
>
> Warmly,
>
> Kristina
>
> On 24 Feb 2013, at 16:40, Avri Doria <avri at ACM.ORG
> <mailto:avri at ACM.ORG>> wrote:
>
>
>
> Hi,
>
> Obviously I am not volunteering for this, but
>
> I think it is a good idea. I think at this point one of the best
> things we can all collectively offer are strong statements from our
> various perspectives on this.
>
> I was planing to work on my own personal statement on why this is not
> a problem and something that was expected, but would gladly work with
> others to produce a common statement several of us could sign on to.
>
> avri
>
> On 24 Feb 2013, at 16:44, Kathy Kleiman wrote:
>
>
> Dear Alain and All,
> I have a question. Who would like to work with me on a statement of
> individuals and organizations within the NCSG? Obviously, we don't
> have consensus and this will not be a Stakeholder Group statement, but
> there seem to be a lot of us with similar concerns - across NPOC and
> NCUC. And further, the issue of generic words used in generic ways is
> a classic noncommercial issue. It's the balance to trademark law...
>
> If you are interested in reviewing a statement or letter, please let
> me know, and we'll create a subgroup.
> If anyone would like to work with me on crafting a statement or
> letter, welcome!
>
> Best,
> Kathy
>
> :
>
> Hi,
>
> I personnally lean heavily in favor of Kathy's position. It seems
> quite reasonable to me for IBM, Accenture, Suzuki or Aga Khan
> Foundation (AKDN for AK Development Network) and many others to use
> their closed gTLD for internal purposes but pure generic words belong
> to everybody, period. So even AFAMILYCOMPANY applied for by Johnson
> Shareholdings Inc would affect not only the use of "family" by all but
> also discriminate against many others such as perhaps the millions of
> family-owned companies!
>
> Bill, I think the "Closed Generics" theme is big enough that it
> warrants an NCSG-wide approach in Bali with distinctive NCUC and NPOC
> events or sessions on different themes our respective Program Teams
> are probably working on right now.
>
> Alain
>
>
>
> On Mon, Feb 11, 2013 at 9:10 AM, William Drake <william.drake at uzh.ch
> <mailto:william.drake at uzh.ch>> wrote:
> Hi
>
> So there's clearly a diversity of views on this issue among reasonable
> people. This was also evident at the IGF meeting in Baku, where we
> spent some time on it in the context of a wider discussion of new
> gTLDs in the Critical Internet Resources main session (I
> co-moderatated, Milton spoke to the issue, as did Anriette Esterhuysen
> from NCUC member APC, the Brazilian ambassador, others...
> http://webcast.igf2012.com/ondemand/.)
>
> For this year's IGF in Bali, Alain and I discussed the possibility of
> proposing a joint NPOC/NCUC Open Forum session, and in addition the
> two constituencies could each organize their own workshops reflecting
> their respective priorities and possibilities. In this context, I'm
> wondering whether closed generics might not be a good topic for a NCUC
> workshop. We could easily get a solid MS panel together with strongly
> diverse views that would probably be of interest to the sort of
> broader, non-GNSO-insider audiences IGFs attract. I can already think
> of a number of developing country government, business, technical and
> CS folks who'd likely be eager to participate as speakers, and it's a
> nicely bounded problem set that'd lend itself to focused consideration
> of commercial and noncommercial arguments etc.
>
> After we get past the WSIS+10 and IGF meetings in Paris I may pitch
> the Program Team a formal proposal on this. If anyone would like to
> conspire, let me know.
>
> Bill
>
> On Feb 10, 2013, at 7:17 PM, Kathy Kleiman <Kathy at kathykleiman.com
> <mailto:Kathy at kathykleiman.com>> wrote:
>
>
> Hi Edward and All,
> I've been meaning to write for some time about Closed Generics. Since
> 1996, I've been fighting the abuse of generic words. The first huge
> domain name dispute battles took place over generic words - that
> trademark owners felt they could use their trademarks (which is, of
> course, a limited right to use a term for a specific category of goods
> and services) to stop ordinary people, organizations and entrepreneurs
> from using ordinary words in ordinary ways. We led a huge fight with
> Network Solutions, and then at the dawn of ICANN, to draft Domain Name
> Dispute Rules that protected generic words used in generic ways as
> part of the public domain -- as belonging to us all!
>
> So when I see so many applicants for "Closed Generic" New gTLDs --
> using a generic word in a generic way and completely monopolizing it
> by *not* allowing your competitors to use it too, I am shocked: .APP,
> .BOOK, .CLOUD, .DRIVE, .MAP, .MOVIE, .NEWS, .SEARCH, .SHOP. .STORE,
> .BLOG, .ANTIVIRUS, .INSURANCE, .HAIR, .MAKEUP, .BABY -- These are
> generic words being used in generic ways (according to their
> applications) for the sole purpose of monopolizing the common term of
> an industry or business -- and keeping its competitors out.
>
> There is no way that L'Oréal could get trademarks on .SKIN, .SALON,
> .MAKEUP and .HAIR, as these words are part of the public domain name
> and available to All their competitors to use -- their trademarks are
> on MAYBELLINE, REDKIN, L'Oréal, and the share the generics as common
> descriptive terms. So it is against every public interest bone in my
> body to allow generic words used in generic ways to be monopolized by
> only one business or industry player.
>
> But is it against the rules? I went back to my work as Director of
> Policy for .ORG, as I was with .ORG through the end of the Applicant
> Guidebook work. I served on the Vertical Integration Working Group in
> a very active way, as well as the Registries group that reviewed every
> line of the "Base Registry Agreement" (the model contract for all new
> gTLDs). We had agreed that, in general, the base model of a Registry
> is "open" -- that Registries must work with ICANN-Accredited
> Registrars worldwide. Why? To reach Registrants worldwide -- to
> offer them domain names in their own languages, currencies and
> customs. (For example, NII Quaynor, a founder of NCUC and early
> Board member, is now one of the few Registrars in Africa, and equal
> access of his Registrants to domain names, on a nondiscriminatory
> basis, has always been important to our system).
>
> So no, I found that we had NOT agreed to Closed Generics. In fact, the
> base model of the New gTLD Registries was meant to be "open" -- and
> ICANN incorporated this "Open gTLD" model into its Base Registry
> Agreement (in the Applicant Guidebook). Section 2.9a and the Registry
> Code of Conduct. No Registry may favor a particular Registrar -- but
> provide Equal Access to its Registry Services and Data. Why? To be
> fair to Registrants! It's nowhere written that Verisign can't limit
> .COM domain names only to the NY Stock Exchange companies, or that
> .ORG can't limit .ORG registrations to only US organizations, but
> everyone knows if they did that, they would lose their accreditation
> with ICANN. Non-discrimination and Equal Access are part of our
> domain name DNA. (See "Base Agreement & Specifications",
> Specification 9, http://newgtlds.icann.org/en/applicants/agb
> <http://newgtlds.icann.org/en/applicants/agb>).
>
> The initial Registry Code of Conduct had no exceptions. Then the
> Commercial Guys got upset-- why should a Dot-Brand TLD, e.g. .IBM,
> have to go through registrars to register domain names, and why should
> they have to register names to the public anyway? (Arguments also made
> in the Vertical Integration WG.) Special privileges for very limited
> use New TLDs - let IBM keep its domain names for its employees,
> franchisees, etc. And frankly, most of us agreed. So the next
> version of the Registry Code of Conduct came out with a narrow exception:
>
> ==> "6. Registry Operator may request an exemption to this Code of
> Conduct, and such exemption may be granted by ICANN in
> ICANN's reasonable discretion, if Registry Operator demonstrates to
> ICANN's reasonable satisfaction that (i) all domain name registrations
> in the TLD are registered to, and maintained by, Registry Operator for
> its own exclusive use, (ii) Registry Operator does not sell,
> distribute or transfer control or use of any registrations in the TLD
> to any third party that is not an Affiliate of Registry Operator, and
> (iii) application of this Code of Conduct to the TLD is not necessary
> to protect the public interest."
>
> It had a comment that made its intent very clear:
> ===> [*Note: This draft Section 6 of the Registry Operator Code of
> Conduct has been added in response to comments received that suggested
> that the Code was not necessary for registries in which a single
> registrant uses the TLD solely for its own operations and does not
> sell registrations to third parties (e.g. a dot-BRAND)]
> (http://archive.icann.org/en/topics/new-gtlds/draft-agreement-specs-redline-15apr11-en.pdf)
>
> And that's where we left it. Of course, some people in the Vertical
> Integration WG wanted much more, and some of them are on this list.
> And some wanted much less- that all gTLDs be open. The compromise was
> to allow dot-BRANDs to be closed, but certainly not any string any
> applicant wanted for any reasons. Generic words used in generic ways
> belong to everyone in the industry or business :-).
>
> I look forward to our discussion, and happy to provide links letters
> and public comment forums.
>
> All the best,
> Kathy
> p.s. Quick additional note on "restricted TLDs." In case anyone is
> wondering, "restricted TLDs" are generally OK among those deeply
> concerned about Closed Generics because restricting .BANK to real
> banks or .LAWYER to lawyers with actual credentials seems consistent
> with non-discrimination and equal access provisions -- provided the
> criteria and fairly and globally applied...
>
>
> Edward Morris wrote:
>
>
> :
>
> Kathy,
>
> I am sympathetic to your position. My concern is that any change now
> to the program will embroil ICANN in mass litigation that will
> paralyze the organization for a considerable period going forward. We
> briefly spoke in Los Angeles about some recent legal hires by Amazon:
> some pretty impressive hires. Can you convince me that my concerns are
> invalid? Might not a better approach at this point be to pressure the
> applicants themselves to open up the generic domains, to make it
> socially unacceptable for large companies to operate closed Tlds?
>
> Ed
>
>
>
> On Wed, Feb 6, 2013 at 8:26 PM, Kathy Kleiman <kathy at kathykleiman.com
> <mailto:kathy at kathykleiman.com>> wrote:
> Quote from Jeff Neuman (VP Neustar) in Amsterdam last week:
> Nearly all of those applying for Closed gTLDs would fail to qualify
> based on his reading of the Code of Conduct.
>
> Article show concern around the world for TLDs which are generic
> strings/words of an entire industry or business (DOCS, BOOK, SEARCH,
> ANTIVIRUS, WATCHES) being dominated and controlled by a single
> industry/business (and only one of many competitors). that's being a
> registry to monoplize a word, not to offer registry services.
>
> - The Hindu: Beauty lies in the 'domain' of the highest bidder
> (Op-ed piece by Parminder Jeet Singh, Executive Director, IT for
> Change, in special consultative status with the United Nations
> Economic and Social Council (IGF attendee)), 12/24/2012,
> http://www.thehindu.com/opinion/op-ed/beauty-lies-in-the-domain-of-the-highest-bidder/article3929612.ece
>
>
> - Forbes: The Battle For The Cloud: Amazon Proposes 'Closed'
> Top-Level .CLOUD Domain, 11/6/2012,
> http://www.forbes.com/sites/reuvencohen/2012/11/06/the-battle-for-the-cloud-amazon-proposes-closed-top-level-cloud-domain/?partner=yahootix
>
>
> - Techworld: Problems arise where one entity is seeking exclusive
> use of strings with broad applicability, 11/21/2012,
> http://news.techworld.com/networking/3412616/icann-issues-early-warnings-over-controversial-top-level-domains/
>
> I am deeply, deeply concerned!
> Best,
> Kathy
>
>
>
> A quote from Karen Lentz (ICANN legal staff): "Under the current
> rules, there's nothing that would prevent the use of closed generics,
> which is focused on the issue of who can register a name."
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: NCSG-Discuss [
> mailto:NCSG-DISCUSS at LISTSERV.SYR.EDU
> ] On Behalf
> Of William Drake
> Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2013 1:18 PM
> To:
> NCSG-DISCUSS at LISTSERV.SYR.EDU <mailto:NCSG-DISCUSS at LISTSERV.SYR.EDU>
>
> Subject: [NCSG-Discuss] new-gtld-committee-not-sure-how-to-handle-
> closed-generic-applications
>
> surprise!
>
>
> http://www.thedomains.com/2013/02/05/icann-new-gtld-committee-not
> -
> sure-how-to-handle-closed-generic-applications/
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> Alain Berranger, B.Eng, MBA
> Member, Board of Directors, CECI, http://www.ceci.ca
> Executive-in-residence, Schulich School of Business,
> www.schulich.yorku.ca <http://www.schulich.yorku.ca>
> Treasurer, Global Knowledge Partnership Foundation,
> www.gkpfoundation.org <http://www.gkpfoundation.org>
> NA representative, Chasquinet Foundation, www.chasquinet.org
> <http://www.chasquinet.org>
> Chair, NPOC, NCSG, ICANN, http://npoc.org/
> O:+1 514 484 7824; M:+1 514 704 7824
> Skype: alain.berranger
>
>
> AVIS DE CONFIDENTIALITÉ
> Ce courriel est confidentiel et est à l'usage exclusif du destinataire
> ci-dessus. Toute personne qui lit le présent message sans en être le
> destinataire, ou l'employé(e) ou la personne responsable de le
> remettre au destinataire, est par les présentes avisée qu'il lui est
> strictement interdit de le diffuser, de le distribuer, de le modifier
> ou de le reproduire, en tout ou en partie . Si le destinataire ne peut
> être joint ou si ce document vous a été communiqué par erreur,
> veuillez nous en informer sur le champ et détruire ce courriel et
> toute copie de celui-ci. Merci de votre coopération.
>
> CONFIDENTIALITY MESSAGE
> This e-mail message is confidential and is intended for the exclusive
> use of the addressee. Please note that, should this message be read by
> anyone other than the addressee, his or her employee or the person
> responsible for forwarding it to the addressee, it is strictly
> prohibited to disclose, distribute, modify or reproduce the contents
> of this message, in whole or in part. If the addressee cannot be
> reached or if you have received this e-mail in error, please notify us
> immediately and delete this e-mail and destroy all copies. Thank you
> for your cooperation.
>
>
>
> --
>
>
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://lists.ncuc.org/pipermail/ncuc-discuss/attachments/20130225/48a678f5/attachment-0001.html>
More information about the Ncuc-discuss
mailing list