The dark side of take down requests

Wed Jun 30 23:41:49 CEST 2010

This raises the question for consumers - how are they to make an informed
choice of registrar?

Are there any sites that make a comparison, including suspension trigger
happiness?

j

On Wed, Jun 30, 2010 at 3:25 PM, Kathy Kleiman <Kathy at kathykleiman.com>wrote:

>  Marc,
> I know everyone tries their best in these situations, but your story is
> classic. I am saving it as a "must-read" for newcomers to the field. Tx,
> Kathy
>
>
> <<It's interesting that Kathy mentioned Godaddy and take down requests. I
> have a personal story about what happened with Godaddy taking out an entire
> data center due to a spam complaint. I was hosted at the data center and a
> friend of mine owns it and he had me make the call knowing that I'm good at
> getting results. The data center was called nectartech.com.
>
>
> What happened was that some customer got hacked and was sending spam. The
> customer was using nectartech.com name servers as was most of their
> customers. On Friday January 13th around 5:00pm Godaddy suspended the
> nectartech.com domain. And it was a 3 day weekend. What happened then was
> a legendary story about how I managed to get nectartech.com back online in
> spite of Godaddy's suspention.
>
> This is a great anecdotal story about what can happen when registrars go
> wild with domain suspension. You can read about it all over the internet by
> googling godaddy and nectartech. What I did was to record the phone call
> with Godaddy support and post it on the Internet/ About 18 hours later,
> service was restored.
>
> The thread starts here:
>
> http://www.webhostingtalk.com/showthread.php?t=477562
>
> And the recording with Godaddy is here:
>
> http://marc.perkel.com/audio/godaddy.mp3
>
> It speaks to the problem Kathy talks about when it comes to due process. In
> this case it was resolved due to some unique skills that aren't available to
> most people. But if anyone needs an example of what happens when a registrar
> wrongly suspends a domain, is one says it all.
>
> On 6/28/2010 1:33 AM, Alex Gakuru wrote:
>
> Carlos,
>
>  Would you be in a position to assert our voices on this WG?
>
>  kindly,
>
>  Alex
>
> On Sun, Jun 27, 2010 at 9:21 PM, Kathy Kleiman <Kathy at kathykleiman.com>wrote:
>
>> Hi Carlos and All,
>> I attended the same session and had similar concerns to those of Carlos.
>> On the good side, for the first time in my recollection of these
>> discussions, law enforcement at least discussed and answered questions about
>> the importance of due process and data protection/privacy laws.
>>
>> on the downside, the road to registrars (and their RAA contract changes)
>> is being paved with a request for every sort of monitoring and takedown
>> request. Christine Jones, the respected General Counsel of GoDaddy,
>> complained bitterly about this in the Public Forum.
>>
>> The other downside is that, in such an important Working Group, there is
>> no NCUC representative. I know there are too many things going on, and too
>> many important issues, but this one is central. If you can put someone on
>> the WG (which has much more work to go), then NCUC's insights,
>> understandings, and concerns for due process and the limits of the scope and
>> mission of ICANN will have a much stronger voice than comments alone.
>>
>> Best,
>> Kathy
>>
>>
>> I will be happy to try and help.
>>>
>>> fraternal regards
>>>
>>> --c.a.
>>>
>>> On 06/24/2010 07:28 AM, Alex Gakuru wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Thu, Jun 24, 2010 at 1:13 PM, Wendy Seltzer<wendy at seltzer.com>
>>>>  wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Thanks Carlos,
>>>>> We should include you in drafting public comments on the RAA report
>>>>> which
>>>>> attached the law enforcement recommendations.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> I second Carlos inclusion on the drafters team.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I think at least some of the law enforcement representatives are
>>>>> concerned
>>>>> about balance, and perhaps we can acknowledge their concerns while
>>>>> recommending safeguards and due process requirements to oppose many of
>>>>> their
>>>>> specific recommendations.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Absolutely! On our comments, please call for privacy law enforcement
>>>> representatives also?
>>>>
>>>> kindly,
>>>>
>>>> Alex
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Best,
>>>>> --Wendy
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On 06/24/2010 06:06 AM, Carlos A. Afonso wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> I have just read the transcript of the panel "Law Enforcement
>>>>>> Amendments to the RAA ", held on 21 June, 2010 during the Brussels
>>>>>> ICANN
>>>>>> meeting. The panel was chaired by ALAC's Cheryl Langdon-Orr. Everyone
>>>>>> seemed to be sort of happy of sharing a discussion room full of police
>>>>>> :)
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I do not understand the role law enforcers are supposed to play in
>>>>>> defining ICANN policies.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Law enforcers such as the FBI, Interpol etc work on a very simple
>>>>>> paradigm: they follow orders, and the more information they get, the
>>>>>> better to fulfill the orders they ought to follow. So they will always
>>>>>> defend the idea that all private data should be recorded and made
>>>>>> available to them whenever they deem necessary. It simply makes their
>>>>>> job easier, and this is enough for them, and is all we will hear from
>>>>>> them, whatever the nice dressing of their discourses.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> However, ICANN should be looking for appropriate policies which abide
>>>>>> by
>>>>>> internationally recognized human rights principles. This is the realm
>>>>>> of
>>>>>> legislators, policy-makers, regulators -- not law enforcers -- and
>>>>>> these
>>>>>> are the organizations ICANN should be talking to in deciding policies
>>>>>> regarding balancing privacy rights with security.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> If decisions regarding the users' / consumers' rights to privacy are
>>>>>> going to be taken on the advice of the police, I do not think we will
>>>>>> arrive at a good end of this story.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --c.a.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> Wendy Seltzer -- wendy at seltzer.org
>>>>> Fellow, Silicon Flatirons Center at University of Colorado Law School
>>>>> Fellow, Berkman Center for Internet&  Society at Harvard University
>>>>> http://cyber.law.harvard.edu/seltzer.html
>>>>> http://www.chillingeffects.org/
>>>>> https://www.torproject.org/
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>
>

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