NCUC & NCSG diversity & participation

[Norbert Klein]

Greetings, Baudouin,
to Central Africa from Cambodia,

this is just a mail to renew our memories - you wrote this two months
ago, and there are so many urgent and important discussions going on
relating to structures - but we have to say it time and again to the
higher level ICANN strategists who want to impose monitoring and
censorship on us ("Are you really active?"), living and working under
difficult technological and economic constraints, that a new kind of
"digital divide" would be imposed by such rules, though they seem to be
"common sense and only technical." They are not.


Norbert Klein

=

Baudouin SCHOMBE wrote:
> I entirely subscribe to what Robin says. It is true that ICANN makes
> much efforts for  participation of  actors of from developing
> countries but should be avoided exclusion by taking account about
> certain parameters which are justifying:  problem of connectivity,
> linguistic diificulties,daily diary….to quote only these.
>
> We also have obligation to frequently share all information which we
> receive with the various plate forme at the local level to collect
> their point of view. And this process is too slow in our countries
> where several  technical and economic factors situation do not allow a
> good communicability.
>
> I still support financial aspect argumented by Robin. In fact, the
> noncommercial users of the developing countries are not the needy ones
> but are often complex situations which do not enable them to mobilize
> sufficient funds to face on certain obligations. If all that must be
> reasons for which the noncommercial users of the developing countries 
> are not entitled to the votes, but then it is where the crowned
> principle of  democracy?
>
> Baudouin
>
> 2009/8/6 Robin Gross <robin at ipjustice.org <mailto:robin at ipjustice.org>>
>
>     I also have significant concerns about ICANN's plan to penalize
>     noncommercial users who are not "active" in the GNSO with less
>     representation.
>
>     When you vote in a democracy, you don't have to prove that you
>     donated 100 hours of community service in order to be entitled to
>     a vote, as ICANN proposes.  No, this is just another another
>     mechanism to gate and minimize user participation and influence.
>
>     What about people in developing countries who can't get online and
>     can't raise the funds to get to ICANN meetings or to be in a
>     position to donate their time to ICANN?   They aren't entitled to
>     a vote on Internet policy because they aren't "active" enough for
>     ICANN?  What about the fact ICANN is mainly conducted in English?
>      It seems non-English speakers who cannot "actively" participate
>     don't deserve a vote either?
>
>     ICANN needs to understand it costs noncommercial organizations and
>     individuals to participate at ICANN in ways that are unique to all
>     other ICANN stakeholders.  There are significant bars to ICANN
>     participation that ICANN cannot use to "gate" to representation of
>     noncommercial users.  Not in a democratic institution accountable
>     to the global public interest.
>
>     Robin
>
>
>     On Aug 6, 2009, at 2:17 AM, William Drake wrote:
>
>>     Hi Adam,
>>
>>     I'm fine with restating openness to dialogue etc as you suggest. 
>>     Not that we haven't before.
>>
>>     Would like to pick up on one specific bit:
>>
>>     On Aug 6, 2009, at 9:37 AM, Adam Peake wrote:
>>
>>>     The NCUC does not have membership (or significant membership)
>>>     from international consumer organizations (noted in many recent
>>>     comments from the board and others as a missing constituent in
>>>     all of ICANN), nor for the largest academic communities,
>>>     libraries, R&D, etc.
>>
>>     This may well be "noted" by the board and others but it is
>>     patently untrue http://ncuc.syr.edu/members.htm.   Just more
>>     disinformation.  (BTW I also noted some on the transcript of the
>>     ALAC call, e.g. Nick saying that the NCUC proposal does not allow
>>     board approval of constituencies...facts don't matter if one
>>     can't be bothered to learn them).
>>
>>     Which is not to say that it wouldn't be great to have more groups
>>     with "consumer" in their title etc.
>>
>>     Perhaps this needs to be a larger, more focused discussion
>>     sometime, but while I think of it it's worth mentioning that
>>     there is also a claim in said circles that our members are not
>>     all sufficiently active and hence our diversity is just on paper,
>>     which in turn is supposed to allow for "capture" by a small
>>     cabal.  This of course is held against us as well, and will be
>>     relevant in the NCSG.  As you know, the staff's "Suggested
>>     Additional Stakeholder Group Charter Elements to Ensure
>>     Transparency, Openness, Fairness and Representativeness
>>     Principles" hold, inter alia, that "It is important that the
>>     Board and the community have the ability to determine what
>>     parties comprise a particular GNSO structure and who participates
>>     in an active way....[hence] Each GNSO structure should collect,
>>     maintain, and publish active and inactive member names identified
>>     by membership category (if applicable)"
>>
>>     I raised concerns about the reasoning and operational
>>     implications of this on the last GNSO call, but they were pretty
>>     much brushed aside.  So I guess in some unknown manner members
>>     will have to show sufficient signs of life on a frequent enough
>>     basis for staff to deem them active and consider their views to
>>     "count" when constituencies state positions.  Oh, and meeting
>>     attendance lists must be published and will be considered too. 
>>     At least, all this undoubtedly will apply to nomcomm
>>     constituencies, business ones may get the usual pass from the
>>     standards to which we're held.
>>
>>     And now I have to reply to the council list about this claim in
>>     the SOI that we are "not yet sufficiently diverse or robust to
>>     select all six"...sigh.  Pushing back on relentless disinfo does
>>     get tiring...
>>
>>     Bill
>

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