<div dir="ltr">Dear Milton and Kathy,<br>Thank you for sharing your views liberally; others have also expressed your opinions. I will wait for more reactions from the list and then forward the feedback to Chris as our response.<br><div></div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div>Kind regards,</div><div>Benjamin </div></div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Mon, Oct 7, 2024 at 6:06 PM Mueller, Milton L <<a href="mailto:milton@gatech.edu">milton@gatech.edu</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div class="msg7773644914034367684">
<div dir="ltr">
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Ben, thanks for initiating this.</div>
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I agree with you that number 4 can be problematic. What does it mean for a SO to be "accountable" externally? This should be changed to something like "adheres to ICANN's mission and fundamental bylaws." SOs are supposed to be representative organizations that
develop policy. The constituencies within SOs are intended to represent, and be accountable to, specific stakeholder groups. To say that they are also accountable to everyone and anyone is either meaningless (impossible to measure), or something that can cause
conflict among stakeholder groups (SGs), because one SG can claim that another SG is "not accountable" because it doesn't serve that other SG's interests. And since there is no effective standard for determining whether an organization is accountable to the
entire world, this cannot do any good but could do harm; e.g., copyright and trademark holders might claim that GNSO is not "externally accountable" because it doesn't always pass policies favorable to trademark and copyright interests.</div>
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The GNSO and ICANN as a whole need to be working within the mission and bylaws, but it is too vague and potentially troublesome to claim that all SOs and SGs are accountable to a "wider community" and "the global Internet population." ICANN as a whole is supposed
to be externally accountable to the global Internet population, but that accountability is expressed through the mechanisms and constraints of the mission and bylaws. It is more focused and meaningful to say that a SO should be accountable to its own stakeholders.
The whole system of ICANN policymaking - not a single SO - is supposed to be accountable to the global Internet community.</div>
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</div>
<div id="m_7773644914034367684appendonsend"></div>
<div id="m_7773644914034367684Signature">
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<br>
</div>
<p>Dr. Milton L Mueller</p>
<p>Georgia Institute of Technology</p>
<p>School of Public Policy</p>
<p><img style="width: 320px; height: 79px; margin-top: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px;" width="320" height="79" src="cid:ii_19268ab1690b81ea0d11"></p>
<p> </p>
</div>
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</div>
<div style="direction:ltr">Dear NCUC members,</div>
<div style="direction:ltr">I would like input in deciding whether all these principles are appropriate. This request had been sent out previously however the emphasis is on number 4.</div>
<div style="direction:ltr"><br>
</div>
<div style="direction:ltr">This is the question the GNSO participants in the <span style="font-size:13.3333px;color:rgb(0,0,0)">
Continuous Improvement Program Community Coordination Group (CIP-CCG) like to know. You can know more about
</span><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;font-size:14.6667px"> </span><span style="font-size:13.3333px;color:rgb(0,0,0)"><b>Continuous Improvement Program Community Coordination Group</b> (CIP-CCG) can be found on this
<a href="https://community.icann.org/display/CIP" id="m_7773644914034367684OWA1cca6792-a143-e4a4-98b9-8bff7a0b5d88" target="_blank">
link</a> below</span></div>
<div style="direction:ltr;font-size:13.3333px;color:rgb(0,0,0)"><br>
</div>
<div style="direction:ltr"><br>
</div>
<div style="direction:ltr;font-size:13.3333px;color:rgb(0,0,0)"><br>
</div>
<ol start="1" style="direction:ltr;margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px">
<li style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;font-size:11pt;direction:ltr;list-style-type:decimal">
<p style="direction:ltr;line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt">
The SO, AC, or NomCom is fulfilling its purpose.</p>
</li></ol>
<div style="direction:ltr"><br>
</div>
<ol start="2" style="direction:ltr;margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px">
<li style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;font-size:11pt;direction:ltr;list-style-type:decimal">
<p style="direction:ltr;line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt">
The structures of SO, AC, or NomCom are effective.<br>
<br>
</p>
</li><li style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;font-size:11pt;direction:ltr;list-style-type:decimal">
<p style="direction:ltr;line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt">
The operations of SO, AC, or NomCom are efficient.<br>
<br>
</p>
</li><li style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;font-size:11pt;direction:ltr;list-style-type:decimal">
<p style="direction:ltr;line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt">
<span style="background-color:rgb(255,255,0)">The SO, AC, or NomCom is accountable internally to its stakeholders and substructures (where applicable), and externally to the wider ICANN community in benefit of the global Internet population.</span><br>
<br>
</p>
</li><li style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;font-size:11pt;direction:ltr;list-style-type:decimal">
<p style="direction:ltr;line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt">
The SO, AC, or NomCom collaborates to further the mission of ICANN.</p>
<div style="direction:ltr"><br>
</div>
</li></ol>
<div style="direction:ltr"><br>
</div>
<div style="direction:ltr"><br>
</div>
<div style="direction:ltr"><br>
</div>
<div style="direction:ltr">---------- Forwarded message ---------<br>
From: <b>Chris Disspain via Gnso-coordination</b> <<a href="mailto:gnso-coordination@icann.org" id="m_7773644914034367684OWA1859649f-096a-031f-c125-b8eb5a72074e" target="_blank">gnso-coordination@icann.org</a>><br>
Date: Wed, Sep 25, 2024 at 11:14 AM<br>
Subject: [Gnso-coordination] Continuous improvement principles re GNSO & Council<br>
To: <<a href="mailto:gnso-coordination@icann.org" id="m_7773644914034367684OWA5ea75e91-38d8-4fa9-4b67-5bcb71d5d4c1" target="_blank">gnso-coordination@icann.org</a>></div>
<div style="direction:ltr"><br>
<br>
</div>
<div style="direction:ltr">Hello All,</div>
<div style="direction:ltr"><br>
</div>
<div style="direction:ltr">As previously discussed, our job as the GNSO SG reps to the Continuous Improvement CCG is to agree a set of principles that will apply to the GNSO and GNSO Council’s continuous improvement efforts.</div>
<div style="direction:ltr"><br>
</div>
<div style="direction:ltr">The current principles from the draft CIP CCG document are below. Bearing in mind that the GNSO CCOICI will be the group that develops the criteria that sit under the principles and that, whilst not essential, it would be optimal
if the overarching principles were the same for all SOs and ACs, can we live with these and if not, what amendments would we like to see?</div>
<div style="direction:ltr"><br>
</div>
<div style="direction:ltr">It would be great to hear back from everyone by next Tuesday 1st October so we can feed our comments into the next CIP meeting on 2nd.</div>
<div style="direction:ltr"></div>
<ol start="1" style="direction:ltr;margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px">
<li style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;font-size:11pt;direction:ltr;white-space:pre-wrap;list-style-type:decimal">
<p style="direction:ltr;line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt">
The SO, AC, or NomCom is fulfilling its purpose.</p>
</li></ol>
<div style="direction:ltr"><br>
</div>
<ol start="2" style="direction:ltr;margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px">
<li style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;font-size:11pt;direction:ltr;white-space:pre-wrap;list-style-type:decimal">
<p style="direction:ltr;line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt">
The structures of SO, AC, or NomCom are effective.</p>
</li><li style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;font-size:11pt;direction:ltr;white-space:pre-wrap;list-style-type:decimal">
<p style="direction:ltr;line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt">
The operations of SO, AC, or NomCom are efficient.</p>
</li><li style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;font-size:11pt;direction:ltr;white-space:pre-wrap;list-style-type:decimal">
<p style="direction:ltr;line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt">
The SO, AC, or NomCom is accountable internally to its stakeholders and substructures (where applicable), and externally to the wider ICANN community in benefit of the global Internet population.</p>
</li><li style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;font-size:11pt;direction:ltr;white-space:pre-wrap;list-style-type:decimal">
<p style="direction:ltr;line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt">
The SO, AC, or NomCom collaborates to further the mission of ICANN.</p>
</li></ol>
<div style="direction:ltr">Cheers,</div>
<div style="direction:ltr"> </div>
<div style="direction:ltr">Chris</div>
<div style="direction:ltr">_______________________________________________<br>
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gnso-coordination@icann.org</a><br>
To unsubscribe send an email to <a href="mailto:gnso-coordination-leave@icann.org" id="m_7773644914034367684OWAe7ad4ffc-2e8d-5e60-9dab-4f1b607991b5" target="_blank">
gnso-coordination-leave@icann.org</a></div>
<div id="m_7773644914034367684appendonsend"></div>
<div style="font-family:Aptos,Aptos_EmbeddedFont,Aptos_MSFontService,Calibri,Helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:12pt;color:rgb(0,0,0)">
<br>
</div>
<hr style="display:inline-block;width:98%">
<div id="m_7773644914034367684divRplyFwdMsg" dir="ltr"><span style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;font-size:11pt;color:rgb(0,0,0)"><b>From:</b> Kathy Kleiman <Kathy@KathyKleiman.com><br>
<b>Sent:</b> Monday, October 7, 2024 9:30 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Mueller, Milton L <<a href="mailto:milton@GATECH.EDU" target="_blank">milton@GATECH.EDU</a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Fwd: [NCUC-DISCUSS] Fwd: [Gnso-coordination] Continuous improvement principles re GNSO & Council</span>
<div> </div>
</div>
<p>Hi Milton,</p>
<p>You are the expert in these areas. Thoughts welcome!</p>
<p>Best, Kathy</p>
<div><br>
<br>
-------- Forwarded Message --------</div>
<table style="border-collapse:collapse;border-spacing:0px;box-sizing:border-box">
<tbody>
<tr>
<th>Subject:</th>
<td>[NCUC-DISCUSS] Fwd: [Gnso-coordination] Continuous improvement principles re GNSO & Council</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<th>Date:</th>
<td>Mon, 7 Oct 2024 08:44:51 +0200</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<th>From:</th>
<td>Benjamin Akinmoyeje <a href="mailto:benakin@gmail.com" id="m_7773644914034367684OWA60cdb82e-a278-a629-99d9-0f2916d0d516" target="_blank">
<benakin@gmail.com></a></td>
</tr>
<tr>
<th>To:</th>
<td>NCUC-discuss <a href="mailto:ncuc-discuss@lists.ncuc.org" id="m_7773644914034367684OWA9257c1a3-7f9a-7214-6a99-73f1e94effa3" target="_blank">
<ncuc-discuss@lists.ncuc.org></a></td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
<br>
<br>
<div style="direction:ltr">Dear NCUC members,</div>
<div style="direction:ltr">I would like input in deciding whether all these principles are appropriate. This request had been sent out previously however the emphasis is on number 4.</div>
<div style="direction:ltr"><br>
</div>
<div style="direction:ltr">This is the question the GNSO participants in the <span style="font-size:13.3333px;color:rgb(0,0,0)">
Continuous Improvement Program Community Coordination Group (CIP-CCG) like to know. You can know more about
</span><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;font-size:14.6667px"> </span><span style="font-size:13.3333px;color:rgb(0,0,0)"><b>Continuous Improvement Program Community Coordination Group</b> (CIP-CCG) can be found on this
<a href="https://community.icann.org/display/CIP" id="m_7773644914034367684OWA2bbcc3e3-6910-745d-806f-eb8becf98a88" target="_blank">
link</a> below</span></div>
<div style="direction:ltr;font-size:13.3333px;color:rgb(0,0,0)"><br>
</div>
<div style="direction:ltr"><br>
</div>
<div style="direction:ltr;font-size:13.3333px;color:rgb(0,0,0)"><br>
</div>
<ol start="1" style="direction:ltr;margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px">
<li style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;font-size:11pt;direction:ltr;list-style-type:decimal">
<p style="direction:ltr;line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt">
The SO, AC, or NomCom is fulfilling its purpose.</p>
</li></ol>
<div style="direction:ltr"><br>
</div>
<ol start="2" style="direction:ltr;margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px">
<li style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;font-size:11pt;direction:ltr;list-style-type:decimal">
<p style="direction:ltr;line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt">
The structures of SO, AC, or NomCom are effective.<br>
<br>
</p>
</li><li style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;font-size:11pt;direction:ltr;list-style-type:decimal">
<p style="direction:ltr;line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt">
The operations of SO, AC, or NomCom are efficient.<br>
<br>
</p>
</li><li style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;font-size:11pt;direction:ltr;list-style-type:decimal">
<p style="direction:ltr;line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt">
<span style="background-color:rgb(255,255,0)">The SO, AC, or NomCom is accountable internally to its stakeholders and substructures (where applicable), and externally to the wider ICANN community in benefit of the global Internet population.</span><br>
<br>
</p>
</li><li style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;font-size:11pt;direction:ltr;list-style-type:decimal">
<p style="direction:ltr;line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt">
The SO, AC, or NomCom collaborates to further the mission of ICANN.</p>
<div style="direction:ltr"><br>
</div>
</li></ol>
<div style="direction:ltr"><br>
</div>
<div style="direction:ltr"><br>
</div>
<div style="direction:ltr"><br>
</div>
<div style="direction:ltr">---------- Forwarded message ---------<br>
From: <b>Chris Disspain via Gnso-coordination</b> <<a href="mailto:gnso-coordination@icann.org" id="m_7773644914034367684OWAffb70430-03eb-8f41-918e-b2d5dcc1c020" target="_blank">gnso-coordination@icann.org</a>><br>
Date: Wed, Sep 25, 2024 at 11:14 AM<br>
Subject: [Gnso-coordination] Continuous improvement principles re GNSO & Council<br>
To: <<a href="mailto:gnso-coordination@icann.org" id="m_7773644914034367684OWAfcbd8e92-cb3f-ceba-e8c0-198963e4c063" target="_blank">gnso-coordination@icann.org</a>></div>
<div style="direction:ltr"><br>
<br>
</div>
<div style="direction:ltr">Hello All,</div>
<div style="direction:ltr"><br>
</div>
<div style="direction:ltr">As previously discussed, our job as the GNSO SG reps to the Continuous Improvement CCG is to agree a set of principles that will apply to the GNSO and GNSO Council’s continuous improvement efforts.</div>
<div style="direction:ltr"><br>
</div>
<div style="direction:ltr">The current principles from the draft CIP CCG document are below. Bearing in mind that the GNSO CCOICI will be the group that develops the criteria that sit under the principles and that, whilst not essential, it would be optimal
if the overarching principles were the same for all SOs and ACs, can we live with these and if not, what amendments would we like to see?</div>
<div style="direction:ltr"><br>
</div>
<div style="direction:ltr">It would be great to hear back from everyone by next Tuesday 1st October so we can feed our comments into the next CIP meeting on 2nd.</div>
<div style="direction:ltr"></div>
<ol start="1" style="direction:ltr;margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px">
<li style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;font-size:11pt;direction:ltr;white-space:pre-wrap;list-style-type:decimal">
<p style="direction:ltr;line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt">
The SO, AC, or NomCom is fulfilling its purpose.</p>
</li></ol>
<div style="direction:ltr"><br>
</div>
<ol start="2" style="direction:ltr;margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px">
<li style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;font-size:11pt;direction:ltr;white-space:pre-wrap;list-style-type:decimal">
<p style="direction:ltr;line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt">
The structures of SO, AC, or NomCom are effective.</p>
</li><li style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;font-size:11pt;direction:ltr;white-space:pre-wrap;list-style-type:decimal">
<p style="direction:ltr;line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt">
The operations of SO, AC, or NomCom are efficient.</p>
</li><li style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;font-size:11pt;direction:ltr;white-space:pre-wrap;list-style-type:decimal">
<p style="direction:ltr;line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt">
The SO, AC, or NomCom is accountable internally to its stakeholders and substructures (where applicable), and externally to the wider ICANN community in benefit of the global Internet population.</p>
</li><li style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;font-size:11pt;direction:ltr;white-space:pre-wrap;list-style-type:decimal">
<p style="direction:ltr;line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt">
The SO, AC, or NomCom collaborates to further the mission of ICANN.</p>
</li></ol>
<div style="direction:ltr">Cheers,</div>
<div style="direction:ltr"> </div>
<div style="direction:ltr">Chris</div>
<div style="direction:ltr">_______________________________________________<br>
Gnso-coordination mailing list -- <a href="mailto:gnso-coordination@icann.org" id="m_7773644914034367684OWA7345c4d9-e87e-cf19-3565-65dde1fb3294" target="_blank">
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</div></blockquote></div>