<div dir="auto"><div>Hello Stephanie, <div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">Hope you are doing great. Though the email was addressed to Dorothy but copied to the general mailing list it means we can also react. While reading the email, this portion caught my attention, <span style="font-family:sans-serif">especially where you indicated 'as a white woman of moderate privileges'</span></div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">Kindly clarify what you are implying by this statement,  "<span style="font-family:sans-serif;font-size:12.8px">Other Chairs may not do this, but <b style="background-color:rgb(255,224,130)">as a white woman of moderate privilege (all things socio-economic being relative)</b> I feel strongly that an independent oversight is required with respect to racist allegations, particularly of leaders."</span></div><div dir="auto"><br></div>Regards</div><div dir="auto">Raymond Mamattah</div><div dir="auto">Accra-Ghana</div><div dir="auto"><br><br><div class="gmail_quote" dir="auto"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Thu, Jun 4, 2020, 1:47 PM Stephanie E Perrin <<a href="mailto:stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca">stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">

  
  <div>
    <p>Dorothy,</p>
    <p>Thank you very much for your contribution to this unfortunate
      discussion!  It is much appreciated!  For members who are not
      aware, the Ombudsman has access to all lists at ICANN and is
      empowered to watch/monitor.  When I receive or see complaints of
      racism or fraud, which are serious allegations, I usually contact
      him directly in case things escalate.  I did so in this case as
      well.  Other Chairs may not do this, but as a white woman of
      moderate privilege (all things socio-economic being relative) I
      feel strongly that an independent oversight is required with
      respect to racist allegations, particularly of leaders.  I feel
      the same about outright harassment actions.  This has of course
      caused a lot of friction within our group, some members feeling
      strongly that the NCSG Chair (and for this thread, the NCUC Chair)
      are empowered by our Charter and procedures to intervene and deal
      with the allegations and behaviour, ultimately rejecting members. 
      Unfortunately, the disagreements in our group frequently escalate
      to the point where they do not, in my opinion, reflect well on us,
      which is why I tried last year to establish a more fulsome code of
      ethics, an idea which has been thoroughly ridiculed and rejected. 
      The conduct on the lists can certainly be dealt with according to
      the Charter and the ICANN expected standards of behaviour
      (<a href="https://www.icann.org/resources/pages/expected-standards-2016-06-28-en" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">https://www.icann.org/resources/pages/expected-standards-2016-06-28-en</a>)
      but I remain, perhaps stubbornly, convinced that other kinds of
      disruptive behaviour and harassment are better dealt with by the
      Ombudsman.  Given the growing tendency to take these fights off
      our lists onto other social media, notably Facebook and Twitter, I
      think the remit of the Chairs is limited.<br>
    </p>
    <p>In any case, I am proposing to the NCSG EC that we develop
      procedures for list monitoring and intervention that would task
      one of the members of the relevant ECs to act as list monitor,
      peacemaker, and ultimately the person in charge of removal of
      offending persons from the lists.  As you correctly point out,
      sometimes things escalate because of language differences, and
      having a list "referee" to help translate meaning or encourage
      people to use less inflammatory language could be valuable.  Every
      time we have these kinds of flareups, we lose members, because the
      dozens of angry emails put them off being a member of our
      organization.  Furthermore, leadership positions being tasked with
      having to perform these referee roles must surely dissuade many of
      our members from running for office.</p>
    <p>Kind regards, Stephanie Perrin<br>
    </p>
    <p><br>
    </p>
    <div>On 2020-06-04 12:40 a.m., dorothy g
      wrote:<br>
    </div>
    <blockquote type="cite">
      
      <div dir="ltr">
        <div class="gmail_default" style="font-size:small">Vaibhav, As
          you can see I am not white.  I can assure you that in English
          the word 'nonsense' is not a racial slur. Anyone can talk
          nonsense. It is not associated with any racial or ethnic
          group. I agree it is not a polite word but it is not racist.
          We are working from different mother-tongue and different
          cultures so sometimes communication suffers as a result. You
          may feel you are being bullied and you have a right to your
          feelings but as an observer I cannot agree with you. I have
          been a member of this group for many years. We may not always
          agree but we can disagree politely. Please do not assume that
          the entire group has no trust in the leadership and process.
          We will learn from this experience and do better.  Sincerely
          wishing you the best.</div>
      </div>
      <br>
      <div class="gmail_quote">
        <div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Wed, Jun 3, 2020 at 7:16 PM
          Vaibhav Aggarwal <<a href="mailto:va@bladebrains.com" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">va@bladebrains.com</a>> wrote:<br>
        </div>
        <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
          <div dir="auto">Franco, 
            <div><br>
            </div>
            <div>Thanks for seeing reason in my point. </div>
            <div>It is important the the Chair at this juncture along
              with the EC is held responsible. And I ask for their
              resignations in the interest of Transparency,
              Accountability, Adherence, & Code of Ethics. </div>
            <div>There is no trust in the current management of this
              group as there is no direction & righteousness.<br>
              <br>
              A Adhoc committee be put in place, elections proposed be
              stopped & group be reconvened for way forward. A
              Minimum Corum of representation be decided for any
              decisions. </div>
            <div><br>
            </div>
            <div>A hand full of 5-8 people running this group like a
              cartel.. </div>
            <div><br>
            </div>
            <div>Since diversity is the basis of this Multi-Stakeholder
              environment,  I bring this up for my brothers &
              sisters from the lesser Privileged / developed ecosystems
              who are putting hard effort in bringing policy up for the
              better. Every one should get an opportunity. Freedom of
              voice should never be suppressed in a stressed
              environment. Equal opportunity is our right. </div>
            <div><br>
            </div>
            <div>The expose and your views on what’s going wrong should
              be sent to the Ombudsman of ICANN - and everyone should
              write to him. It’s important to be heard.</div>
            <div><br>
            </div>
            <div>Read this in addition to my views above, I was a victim
              of racial abuse yesterday in front of everyone - Nonsense
              is what I was called - And I was reprimanded, my integrity
              was attacked upon & today being threatened & my
              privacy being violted by the Chair herself in a most
              casual manner. This is not good. This is bullying &
              harassment. </div>
            <div><br>
            </div>
            <div>Post the email, I won’t know if I am onslought be
              brought upon me by some, and If I will still be here or my
              list access be barred, but I would certainly die a free
              man. Some good will I be able to do, form some to do good
              on policy. The world needs you. </div>
            <div><br>
            </div>
            <div>Rest is ur imagination & wisdom. </div>
            <div><br>
            </div>
            <div>Yours sincerely, </div>
            <div>-VA</div>
            <div><a href="http://www.thevaibhav.com" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">www.thevaibhav.com</a></div>
            <div>+91.9899246969</div>
            <div>New Delhi, India</div>
            <div><br>
            </div>
            <div>
              <div dir="ltr">Sent from my mobile device. Typos
                regretted. </div>
              <div dir="ltr"><br>
                <blockquote type="cite">On Jun 3, 2020, at 9:45 PM,
                  franco giandana <<a href="mailto:fgiandana@gmail.com" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">fgiandana@gmail.com</a>>
                  wrote:<br>
                  <br>
                </blockquote>
              </div>
              <blockquote type="cite">
                <div dir="ltr">
                  <div dir="ltr">Hello everyone, 
                    <div><br>
                    </div>
                    <div>As a current member of the NCUC EC representing
                      the LAC region, I will be raising this subject and
                      the comments exposed in this thread to the entire
                      EC. I hope we can bring some updated soon. </div>
                    <div><br>
                    </div>
                    <div>Please reach out to me if you have any
                      questions. </div>
                    <div><br>
                    </div>
                    <div>Kind regards, </div>
                    <div><br>
                    </div>
                    <div>Franco</div>
                  </div>
                  <br>
                  <div class="gmail_quote">
                    <div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">El mié., 3 jun.
                      2020 a las 10:22, Vaibhav Aggarwal, Catalyst &
                      Group CEO (<<a href="mailto:va@bladebrains.com" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">va@bladebrains.com</a>>)
                      escribió:<br>
                    </div>
                    <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
                      <div>If anybody has missed this email - Like the
                        Chair / EC. 
                        <div><br>
                        </div>
                        <div>The group will be eager to know. </div>
                        <div><br>
                        </div>
                        <div>Regards,</div>
                        <div>-VA<br>
                          <div><br>
                            <blockquote type="cite">
                              <div>On Jun 3, 2020, at 5:57 PM, KASWESHA
                                <<a href="mailto:kaswesha@gmail.com" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">kaswesha@gmail.com</a>>
                                wrote:</div>
                              <br>
                              <div>
                                <div dir="auto">Hello everyone. Hope all
                                  is well during this pandemic period
                                  that has paralysed almost everything
                                  around the globe.
                                  <div dir="auto"><br>
                                  </div>
                                  <div dir="auto">I declared my interest
                                    in representing North America now
                                    that I am a permanent resident
                                    here,  however no one responded to
                                    my self-nomination.  As we continue
                                    the search for a suitable
                                    representative from the region I
                                    would still request to know from
                                    either the EC or even membership
                                    fraternity whether it's that I am
                                    not eligible for this position or I
                                    am non-active member of the group.</div>
                                  <div dir="auto"><br>
                                  </div>
                                  <div dir="auto">Have a great time
                                    wherever you are.</div>
                                  <div dir="auto"><br>
                                  </div>
                                  <div dir="auto">Best regards;</div>
                                  <div dir="auto"><br>
                                  </div>
                                  <div dir="auto">James Njoroge Gitau</div>
                                  <div dir="auto">Elsmere, Kentucky</div>
                                  <div dir="auto">United States of
                                    America</div>
                                </div>
                                <br>
                                <div class="gmail_quote">
                                  <div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On
                                    Wed, Jun 3, 2020, 6:51 AM Louise
                                    Marie Hurel <<a href="mailto:louise.marie.hsd@gmail.com" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">louise.marie.hsd@gmail.com</a>>
                                    wrote:<br>
                                  </div>
                                  <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
                                    <div dir="ltr">
                                      <div>Hi all,</div>
                                      <div><br>
                                      </div>
                                      <div>I would like to echo Bruna's
                                        points here and add another.</div>
                                      <div><br>
                                      </div>
                                      <div>We have a great membership
                                        that spreads throughout
                                        different regions. Not having a
                                        filled position for the NA is
                                        unfortunate, we should be able
                                        to have a healthy and
                                        competitive election. If you
                                        would like to know more about
                                        the NCUC EC, please feel free to
                                        reach out and we will gladly
                                        have a chat. If you think that
                                        you could contribute to
                                        enhancing the role of
                                        non-commercial interests but
                                        might still be unsure about
                                        where to start, we can also help
                                        you. However, we do encourage
                                        you to get in touch - we're nice
                                        folks ha :) <br>
                                      </div>
                                      <div><br>
                                      </div>
                                      <div>As Bruna mentioned, there's
                                        time to think, you have time to
                                        think before we open up a call
                                        for interest to the North
                                        American Representative at the
                                        NCUC EC. <br>
                                      </div>
                                      <div><br>
                                      </div>
                                      <div>All the best,<br>
                                      </div>
                                      <div>
                                        <div>
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                                                          <div dir="ltr"><span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif"><font><b>Louise Marie Hurel</b></font></span></div>
                                                          <p style="margin:0cm 0cm 0.0001pt"><span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif"><font><span style="font-size:11px"></span></font></span></p>
                                                          <div style="margin:0cm 0cm 0.0001pt"><span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif"><font><span style="font-size:11px">Research
                                                          and Project
                                                          Development
                                                          Cybersecurity
                                                          and Digital
                                                          Liberties
                                                          Programme |
                                                          Igarapé
                                                          Institute</span></font></span></div>
                                                          <div style="margin:0cm 0cm 0.0001pt"><span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif"><font><span style="font-size:11px">PhD
                                                          Student Data,
                                                          Networks, and
                                                          Society |
                                                          London School
                                                          of Economics
                                                          and Political
                                                          Science (LSE)</span></font></span></div>
                                                          <div style="margin:0cm 0cm 0.0001pt"><span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif"><a href="https://www.researchgate.net/profile/Louise_Marie_Hurel/publications" rel="noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank"><font size="1">Publications
                                                          <br>
                                                          </font></a></span></div>
                                                          <div><span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif"><font size="1">Skype:
                                                          louise.dias |
                                                          Twitter: <a href="https://twitter.com/LouMarieHSD" rel="noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">@LouMarieHSD</a><br>
                                                          </font></span></div>
                                                          <div><span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif"><font size="1"><span><a href="mailto:louise@igarape.org.br" rel="noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">louise@igarape.org.br</a></span></font></span></div>
                                                          <div><span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif"><font size="1" color="#444444"><a href="mailto:louise.marie.hsd@gmail.com" rel="noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">louise.marie.hsd@gmail.com</a> </font></span></div>
                                                          <div><span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif"><br>
                                                          </span></div>
                                                          <div>
                                                          <div style="margin:0cm 0cm 0.0001pt;font-size:11pt"><span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif"><b><span style="font-size:9.5pt">Recent
                                                          publication</span></b><span style="font-size:9.5pt">s:
                                                          </span></span></div>
                                                          <div style="margin:0cm 0cm 0.0001pt;font-size:11pt"><span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif"><span style="font-size:9.5pt">Hinojosa,
                                                          P; Aiken, K;
                                                          & Hurel,
                                                          LM (2020). “</span><b><span style="font-size:9.5pt">Putting the technical community back into cyber
                                                          (policy)</span></b><span style="font-size:9.5pt">”. In: Tikk and Kertunen. Routledge Handbook of
                                                          International
                                                          Cybersecurity.
                                                          London:
                                                          Routledge.</span></span></div>
                                                          <div style="margin:0cm 0cm 0.0001pt;font-size:11pt"><span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif"><br>
                                                          </span></div>
                                                          <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm 0cm 0.0001pt;font-size:11pt">
                                                          </p>
                                                          <div style="margin:0cm 0cm 0.0001pt;font-size:11pt"><span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif"><span style="font-size:9.5pt">Hurel,
                                                          L. M. &
                                                          Lobato, L. C.
                                                          (forthcoming)
                                                          “<b>Cyber-Norms
Entrepreneurship? Understanding Microsoft’s advocacy
                                                          on
                                                          cybersecurity</b>”.
                                                          In D. Broeders
                                                          & B. Van
                                                          Der Berg
                                                          (Eds.), <i>Governing
                                                          Cyberspace:
                                                          Behaviour,
                                                          Power and
                                                          Diplomacy.</i>
                                                          Rowman and
                                                          Littlefield.</span></span></div>
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                                    <div class="gmail_quote">
                                      <div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On
                                        Tue, 2 Jun 2020 at 18:59, Bruna
                                        Martins dos Santos <<a href="mailto:bruna.mrtns@gmail.com" rel="noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank">bruna.mrtns@gmail.com</a>>
                                        wrote:<br>
                                      </div>
                                      <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
                                        <div dir="ltr">Dear all, 
                                          <div><br>
                                          </div>
                                          <div>After reflecting with the
                                            NCUC EC about the lack of
                                            candidates for the position
                                            of NCUC EC representative
                                            for North America, we have
                                            decided to follow up with
                                            the election deadlines as
                                            they are and to not reopen
                                            the nomination period for
                                            this specific seat. </div>
                                          <div><br>
                                          </div>
                                          <div>Once we conclude this
                                            process the EC will follow
                                            up with a call for interest
                                            to the North American
                                            Representative at the NCUC
                                            EC, and move with the
                                            appointment based on the
                                            current EC decision. </div>
                                          <div><br>
                                          </div>
                                          <div>Something that was also
                                            considered was the fact that
                                            we did not have a candidate
                                            until now so maybe reopening
                                            a call for interest once we
                                            are done with this election
                                            process will give our
                                            members some time to think
                                            about it. </div>
                                          <div><br>
                                          </div>
                                          <div>Last but not least, I
                                            would also like to note that
                                            this was an unanimous
                                            decision from the NCUC
                                            Leadership Team. <br>
                                            <br>
                                            <br>
                                            Best Regards, </div>
                                          <div>
                                            <div><br>
                                            </div>
                                            -- <br>
                                            <div dir="ltr">
                                              <div dir="ltr">
                                                <div dir="ltr">
                                                  <div dir="ltr">
                                                    <div dir="ltr">
                                                      <div dir="ltr">
                                                        <div><b><i>Bruna
                                                          Martins dos
                                                          Santos </i></b></div>
                                                        <div>NCUC Chair</div>
                                                      </div>
                                                    </div>
                                                  </div>
                                                </div>
                                              </div>
                                            </div>
                                          </div>
                                        </div>
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                                      </blockquote>
                                    </div>
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                            </blockquote>
                          </div>
                          <br>
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        </blockquote>
      </div>
      <br clear="all">
      <div><br>
      </div>
      -- <br>
      <div dir="ltr">
        <div dir="ltr">
          <div><br>
          </div>
          <div>stay well, kind regards</div>
          Dorothy Gordon</div>
      </div>
      <br>
      <fieldset></fieldset>
      <pre>_______________________________________________
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    </blockquote>
  </div>

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</blockquote></div></div></div>