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<p>Thanks Stephanie - well said (and Dorothy, too), particularly in
relation restoring the tenor of communication on this list and
moving more positively along in light of the election results.<br>
</p>
<p>Joy Liddicoat<br>
</p>
<br>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 12/10/2018 1:58 AM, Stephanie Perrin
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:111bf043-9b1d-b288-50f3-54ca49a4c305@mail.utoronto.ca">
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<p class=""><font class="" size="+1"><font class="" face="Lucida
Grande">Hi Everyone!<br class="">
</font></font></p>
<p class=""><font class="" size="+1"><font class="" face="Lucida
Grande">I have been staying out of this discussion because
as the incoming NCSG Chair, I sense that a torch may be
thrown in my direction two weeks from now, and I will have
to undertake some revision of our Charter. As others have
stated, there is no rule that prevents a person from running
for both constituencies. I believe there are such rules in
other SGs, and I will do my homework over the next two
weeks.</font></font></p>
<p class=""><font class="" size="+1"><font class="" face="Lucida
Grande">As Dorothy has said so well, fractious (if frank)
discussions on this list may not be helping us work
together. Perhaps we can try to focus on some positive
steps moving forwards. And if I may paraphrase what she
said in her second last sentence...the proof of the pudding
is in the eating. <br class="">
</font></font></p>
<p class=""><font class="" size="+1"><font class="" face="Lucida
Grande">Personally, I do feel that we should have some kind
of rule whereby a person represents one constituency at a
time....which is not to say in the slightest that we cannot
move back and forth, join both, or become just an NCSG
member eschewing all identification of constituency. The
plain fact is that taking a leadership role in NCSG,
wherever one does it, is demanding. Our primary job here is
policy development.....and as I have said many times, if you
are not paying attention to policy, not following the
development of documents and comments, you are not really
helping us out in our primary work. To all those who
do....who volunteer to hold the pen, pester the other
commenters to contribute on time, etc., many many thanks.
As leaders, we hate having to do this all the time. To my
way of thinking, all leaders should be following the PDP
work and sharing that load, which is a serious time
commitment. We should not have to rely on a few workhorses
to actually join the PDPs and do the fighting. We are
stretched to the limits folks. If tempers seem a little
frayed on this list at times, please be understanding. Just
ask me how many hours some of our people are putting in on
our collective behalf....I try to keep track.</font></font></p>
<p class=""><font class="" size="+1"><font class="" face="Lucida
Grande">So while I hope this discussion will all be resolved
amicably by the time I take over from Farzi as NCSG
Chair....and noting that she has been working absolutely
tirelessly on our behalf, under difficult and trying
circumstances....I would be happy to discuss whether a rule
change is in order. Thanks to those who have made this
suggestion.<br class="">
</font></font></p>
<p><font class="" size="+1"><font class="" face="Lucida Grande">At
some point, preferably not in the middle of a rather heated
discussion, I would like to bring up the topic of how we
communicate on this list. We have different cultural
expectations, in my view. For some of us, a frank
discussion of facts can be construed as a personal attack.
As a North American, I tend to favor frankness, hopefully
with a view to appreciating that people are volunteering
their time and have feelings and interests wrapped up in
this work. Nevertheless, we need to be able to discuss what
is happening, introduce facts, and not be worried about
flattering everyone all the time. If it will help, I will
undertake to send out a "good job everyone!!!" note every
month to remind us (and myself) that we are all trying our
best. However, please let us not take criticism
personally. We need to be direct with one another to be
clear about our expectations and goals.</font></font></p>
<p><font class="" size="+1"><font class="" face="Lucida Grande">Stephanie
Perrin<br>
</font></font></p>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 2018-10-10 02:54, dorothy g wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:CAH2xXE7Bg5x2+7bZkuROW27Kqg-e0Pz2zUAnm=_J4YH8UYgMgw@mail.gmail.com">
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<div dir="ltr">Dear Friends, These exchanges are not helping to
build our community. Also certain language and accusations
have been made by some parties that are not helpful. Please
stop and let us get on with the main tasks. If there are
serious procedural concerns we should be clear on what exactly
needs to be changed and why without personalising the
situation. I believe our two communities work together and we
should not squabble over travel support.This is petty. Let us
appreciate that different members of the community contribute
in different ways. Someone was elected. If the rules made them
ineligible that should have been sorted out before the
election. Let us move on.
<div>Farzaneh, Thanks for objecting to those 'gender-biased'
adjectives. Women should not be bullied into silence. As I
have said earlier we will miss you. We may not always agree
but I have always found you to be professional in your
approach.<br>
<div>David let me say that most of us are looking forward to
you making stellar contributions during your term. This
remains the best way to silence detractors.</div>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>best regards</div>
</div>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">
<div dir="ltr">On Wed, Oct 10, 2018 at 6:37 AM David Cake <<a
href="mailto:dave@davecake.net" target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">dave@davecake.net</a>> wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
.8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div
style="word-wrap:break-word;line-break:after-white-space"><br>
<div><br>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div>On 10 Oct 2018, at 10:53 am, Raphaël
Beauregard-Lacroix <<a
href="mailto:rbeauregardlacroix@gmail.com"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">rbeauregardlacroix@gmail.com</a>>
wrote:</div>
<div>
<div dir="ltr">
<div>The only certainty I have in the current case
is that out of fairness, it should not be
possible to pile up travel grants by virtue of
holding multiple positions. Again, I do not know
whether this has occurred or is occuring in our
present case. </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>And what I understand here as "piling up" is
not having several opportunities to obtain
travel funds for one given meeting, but actually
obtaining more than "one" allocation of travel
funds through the multiple hats or getting
travel funds more often than others just by
virtue of holding several positions. I do not
know what coordinating mechanisms there are
between NCSG/NPOC/NCUC as far as travel grants
are concerned, and whether there are rules as to
"who pays" (or who <i>should </i>pay) for
people with multiple hats, but that is also
something that could and should be discussed. </div>
</div>
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<div><br>
</div>
<span class="m_1914150582591474485m_9042148869333495478Apple-tab-span" style="white-space:pre-wrap"> </span>Travel
funding is a complex issue, but I do not believe that
acquiring multiple travel funding without re-allocation
is likely to happen within our current SG system. There
are some slight wrinkles here and there (such as using
funds from one sources to top up travel support from
another, as has happened for various reasons when ICANN
funding does not cover a full meeting or meeting
associated events), but I certainly do not anticipate
that the amount of travel resources available overall
will be in any way reduced. </div>
<div><span class="m_1914150582591474485m_9042148869333495478Apple-tab-span" style="white-space:pre-wrap"> </span>There
are also, of course, funding for various special purpose
roles within ICANN (such as WGs, mentoring, etc), but
they each have separate rules.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><span class="m_1914150582591474485m_9042148869333495478Apple-tab-span" style="white-space:pre-wrap"> </span>David</div>
</div>
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<pre class="moz-signature" cols="72">--
Joy Liddicoat
@internetrights</pre>
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