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<div id="divRplyFwdMsg" dir="ltr" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><font face="Calibri, sans-serif" color="#000000" style="font-size:11pt"><b>发件人:</b> James Gannon <james@cyberinvasion.net><br>
<b>发送时间:</b> 2017年4月22日 21:28<br>
<b>收件人:</b> Peter Green<br>
<b>抄送:</b> ncuc-discuss@lists.ncuc.org<br>
<b>主题:</b> RE: [NCUC-DISCUSS] 答复: 答复: Statement from Zuan Zhang (Peter Green) Complaint to Ombudsman</font>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Peter,</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><span style="color: rgb(255, 0, 0); font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; font-size: 14.6667px;">James, </span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><span style="color: rgb(255, 0, 0); font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; font-size: 14.6667px;">For clarity, my comments are in red:</span><br>
</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">You are confused, the ICANN ombudsman has no jurisdiction over the membership status in the NCUC, that rests with the NCUC EC who have via Rafik’s
message confirmed their position stands, neither has the current NCUC EC changed their position.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><span style="color: rgb(255, 0, 0); font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; font-size: 11pt;"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><span style="color: rgb(255, 0, 0); font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; font-size: 11pt;"></span><span style="color: rgb(255, 0, 0); font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; font-size: 11pt;">I do know that the Ombudsman
could not decide on </span><span style="color: rgb(255, 0, 0); font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; font-size: 11pt;">the NCUC membership issue. I do know this.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><span style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; font-size: 11pt;"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><span style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; font-size: 11pt;"></span><span style="font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; font-size: 11pt;">No one has violated ICANNs standards of behavior in their discussions
with you on this matter, which have been handled in a polite and courteous manner throughout. These conflicts of interest arise and must be dealt with as they arise. No one has questioned your integrity or your personal motives, this is merely something that
happened (almost a year ago) and has been dealt with and yes, is closed.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><span style="color: rgb(255, 0, 0);">I did not deny that "[n]o one has violated ICANN['s] standards of behavior in their discussions with [me]
on this matter, which have been handled in a polite and courteous manner throughout".</span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><span style="color: rgb(255, 0, 0); font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; font-size: 11pt;">Also </span><span style="color: rgb(255, 0, 0); font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; font-size: 11pt;">I did not deny that "[n]o
one has questioned [my] integrity or [my] personal motives."</span><br>
</p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><span style="color: rgb(255, 0, 0);"><span style="color: rgb(255, 0, 0); font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; font-size: 14.6667px;">Everybody is
kind in discussions of this case. </span>I do appreciate that. </span></span><span style="color: rgb(255, 0, 0); font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; font-size: 11pt;"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><span style="color: rgb(255, 0, 0);">However, the point I am talking is transparency and legitimacy. </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><span style="color: rgb(255, 0, 0);">Is transparency and legitimacy equal to ICANN standards of behavior?</span><br>
</p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><span style="color: rgb(255, 0, 0);">You mentioned that "this is merely something that happened (almost a year ago) and has been dealt with…", however, in my view, it was dealt with in a non-transparent and
non-legitimate way according to the currently effective NCUC Bylaws. </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><span style="color: rgb(255, 0, 0);">In my following emails(if permitted), I will elaborate on the reason why I say <span style="color: rgb(255, 0, 0); font-family: Calibri, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif, EmojiFont, 'Apple Color Emoji', 'Segoe UI Emoji', NotoColorEmoji, 'Segoe UI Symbol', 'Android Emoji', EmojiSymbols; font-size: 16px;">it
was dealt with in a non-transparent and non-legitimate way.</span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><span style="color: rgb(255, 0, 0);">It's my view that the case is not closed in the Ombudsman's side.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><span style="color: rgb(255, 0, 0);"><br>
</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">For the record Herb has not asked to “</span><span style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">the Ombudsman recently decided to take
the discussion to the NCUC mailing list aiming to engage more people to look into what happened.</span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">” This is not a factual statement based on Mr Waynes message to the NCUC list which read
in its entirety</span><br>
</p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">“</span><span style="font-size: 11pt;">Please find below a statement
from Zuan Zhang (Peter Green). Attached is the initial request for his resignation and his response. This statement is in response to the statement posted by the former NCUC EC on April 10, 2017.”</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><br>
</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><span style="font-size: 14.6667px; color: rgb(255, 0, 0);">Yes, merely based on the above sentence, we could not read Herb, as the Ombudsman, decided to take the discussion to the NCUC list.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><span style="font-size: 14.6667px; color: rgb(255, 0, 0);">If he could further </span><span style="font-size: 14.6667px; color: rgb(255, 0, 0);">comment via any means in this list</span><span style="font-size: 14.6667px; color: rgb(255, 0, 0);">,
he may tell why I am posting my commnets here.</span><br>
</p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"> <span style="color: rgb(255, 0, 0);"></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">In my opinion this is a closed matter from the perspective of the NCUC. Also Herb is not a member of NCUC and thus is not subscribed to this list.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><span style="color: rgb(255, 0, 0); font-family: Calibri, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif, EmojiFont, 'Apple Color Emoji', 'Segoe UI Emoji', NotoColorEmoji, 'Segoe UI Symbol', 'Android Emoji', EmojiSymbols; font-size: 16px;"><br>
</span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><span style="color: rgb(255, 0, 0); font-family: Calibri, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif, EmojiFont, 'Apple Color Emoji', 'Segoe UI Emoji', NotoColorEmoji, 'Segoe UI Symbol', 'Android Emoji', EmojiSymbols; font-size: 16px;">It's
my view that the case is not closed, at least in the Ombudsman's side. </span><br>
</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><span style="color: rgb(255, 0, 0);">Of course, Herb is not a member of NCUC.</span><br>
</p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><span style="color: rgb(255, 0, 0);"><br>
</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><span style="color: rgb(255, 0, 0); font-size: 12pt;">Currently, I did not receive any formal notification from</span><span style="color: rgb(255, 0, 0); font-size: 12pt;"> </span><span style="color: rgb(255, 0, 0); font-size: 12pt;">the
Ombudsman that he </span><span style="color: rgb(255, 0, 0); font-size: 12pt;">had decided that my case is closed."</span><br>
</p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><font color="#ff0000">If I received, I will stop.</font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><font color="#ff0000"><br>
</font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><font color="#ff0000">I will write to the Ombudsman to ask whether the case is closed in his side and whether I should continue the discussion here.</font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><font color="#ff0000"><span style="font-family: Calibri, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif, EmojiFont, 'Apple Color Emoji', 'Segoe UI Emoji', NotoColorEmoji, 'Segoe UI Symbol', 'Android Emoji', EmojiSymbols; font-size: 14.6667px; color: rgb(255, 0, 0);">Or
if he could further </span><span style="font-family: Calibri, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif, EmojiFont, 'Apple Color Emoji', 'Segoe UI Emoji', NotoColorEmoji, 'Segoe UI Symbol', 'Android Emoji', EmojiSymbols; font-size: 14.6667px; color: rgb(255, 0, 0);">comment
via any means in this list</span><span style="font-family: Calibri, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif, EmojiFont, 'Apple Color Emoji', 'Segoe UI Emoji', NotoColorEmoji, 'Segoe UI Symbol', 'Android Emoji', EmojiSymbols; font-size: 14.6667px; color: rgb(255, 0, 0);">,
he may tell us</span><span style="font-family: Calibri, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif, EmojiFont, 'Apple Color Emoji', 'Segoe UI Emoji', NotoColorEmoji, 'Segoe UI Symbol', 'Android Emoji', EmojiSymbols; font-size: 14.6667px; color: rgb(255, 0, 0);">.</span><br>
</font></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size: 11pt;"><span style="color: rgb(255, 0, 0);">Thank you!</span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size: 11pt;"><br>
</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size: 11pt;">-James</span><br>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> </span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> Peter Green [mailto:seekcommunications@hotmail.com]
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<b>Sent:</b> Saturday, April 22, 2017 2:21 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> James Gannon <james@cyberinvasion.net><br>
<b>Cc:</b> ncuc-discuss@lists.ncuc.org<br>
<b>Subject:</b> </span><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"MS Gothic"">答复</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">: [NCUC-DISCUSS]
</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"MS Gothic"">答复</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">:
</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"MS Gothic"">答复</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">: Statement from Zuan Zhang (Peter Green) Complaint to Ombudsman</span></p>
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<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">Dear James,</span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">Thanks for your comment.</span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">So you are assuming that "to leave this issue as closed and move on instead of tyring to reopen a closed case?</span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">Am I trying to reopen a closed case?</span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">Is this case closed?</span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">To respond:</span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">In last August, I took the case to the Ombudsman. After 8 months, several rounds of discussion among me, the Ombudsman and our former EC, the Ombudsman recently decided to take the discussion to
the NCUC mailing list aiming to engage more people to look into what happened.</span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">James, now you think the case is closed?</span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">Before going forward, I would like to have the Ombudsman's view whether we should continue the discussion here.</span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">It's still my view that last August I was removed by our former EC from the EC in a non-transparent and non-legitimate way.</span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">I have doubt. So I took the case to the Ombudsman to seek resolution.</span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">Dear Mr. @Herb Waye,</span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">I am not sure if you are still on this list and take care of this.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">I would like to have your view whether this case is closed and should not continue discussion here.
</span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">Thank you!</span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">Best</span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">Peter</span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Microsoft JhengHei",sans-serif; color:black">发件人</span></b><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">
James Gannon <</span><a href="mailto:james@cyberinvasion.net"><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">james@cyberinvasion.net</span></a><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">><br>
</span><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Microsoft JhengHei",sans-serif; color:black">发送时间</span></b><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">
2017</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"MS Gothic"; color:black">年</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">4</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"MS Gothic"; color:black">月</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">22</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"MS Gothic"; color:black">日</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">
20:56<br>
</span><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"MS Gothic"; color:black">收件人</span></b><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">
Peter Green; Stephanie Perrin<br>
</span><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"MS Gothic"; color:black">抄送</span></b><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">
</span><a href="mailto:ncuc-discuss@lists.ncuc.org"><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">ncuc-discuss@lists.ncuc.org</span></a><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"><br>
</span><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"MS Gothic"; color:black">主</span></b><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Microsoft JhengHei",sans-serif; color:black">题</span></b><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">
RE: [NCUC-DISCUSS] </span><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"MS Gothic"; color:black">答复</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">:
</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"MS Gothic"; color:black">答复</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">: Statement from Zuan Zhang (Peter Green) Complaint to Ombudsman</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">
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<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">Peter,</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">As you have now stated your representing the RySG as an alternate member for CONAC (Or have applied to do so) I would think the honorable thing would
be to leave this issue as closed and move on instead of trying to reopen a closed case.</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> Ncuc-discuss [</span><a href="mailto:ncuc-discuss-bounces@lists.ncuc.org"><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">mailto:ncuc-discuss-bounces@lists.ncuc.org</span></a><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Peter Green<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Saturday, April 22, 2017 1:46 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Stephanie Perrin <</span><a href="mailto:stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca"><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca</span></a><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">><br>
<b>Cc:</b> </span><a href="mailto:ncuc-discuss@lists.ncuc.org"><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">ncuc-discuss@lists.ncuc.org</span></a><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [NCUC-DISCUSS] </span><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"MS Gothic"; color:black">答复</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">:
</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"MS Gothic"; color:black">答复</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">: Statement from Zuan Zhang (Peter Green) Complaint to Ombudsman</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
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<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">Hi Stephanie,</span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">Thanks for your reply.</span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">In my last email, I was only asking for your reply to the point whether there was a CONAC booth in ICANN 55-Marrakech and you saw me on duty at the booth.</span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">Let's just focus on this point.</span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">In your reply, you are still mentioning that I worked at the CONAC booth in ICANN 55-Marrakech.</span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">You did not answer my question "are you sure there was a CONAC booth in ICANN 55"?</span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">To be clear, there was not a CONAC booth at all in ICANN 55-Marrakech.</span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">When you added that "Peter was on duty at the CONAC booth while attending Marrakech", you are misleading people who watch this discussion here.</span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">Your are incorrect.</span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">Your adding is causing folks' further misunderstanding on me.</span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">I would like to correct that and hope you could stop here on this simple point.</span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">Let's speak based on true facts, not on wrong assumptions or memories.</span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">When you did not have the right information, communication from your part would become misunderstanding.</span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">Communication should be based on right information, regardless of whoever.</span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">In my following emails, I will communicate directly with our NCUC members who commented on this case.</span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">Thanks!</span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">Best</span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">Peter</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Microsoft JhengHei",sans-serif; color:black">发件人</span></b><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">
Stephanie Perrin <</span><a href="mailto:stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca"><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca</span></a><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">><br>
</span><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Microsoft JhengHei",sans-serif; color:black">发送时间</span></b><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">
2017</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"MS Gothic"; color:black">年</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">4</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"MS Gothic"; color:black">月</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">22</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"MS Gothic"; color:black">日</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">
0:08<br>
</span><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"MS Gothic"; color:black">收件人</span></b><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">
Peter Green<br>
</span><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"MS Gothic"; color:black">抄送</span></b><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">
</span><a href="mailto:ncuc-discuss@lists.ncuc.org"><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">ncuc-discuss@lists.ncuc.org</span></a><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"><br>
</span><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"MS Gothic"; color:black">主</span></b><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Microsoft JhengHei",sans-serif; color:black">题</span></b><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">
Re: </span><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"MS Gothic"; color:black">答复</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">: [NCUC-DISCUSS] Statement from Zuan Zhang (Peter Green) Complaint to Ombudsman</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">
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<p><span style="font-size:13.5pt; font-family:"Lucida Grande",serif; color:black">Hi Peter,
</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p><span style="font-size:13.5pt; font-family:"Lucida Grande",serif; color:black">I do think part of the problem here is that perhaps we were not getting communication from you at the correct time. Now you seem to be very motivated to communicate, which is
great. </span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p><span style="font-size:13.5pt; font-family:"Lucida Grande",serif; color:black">I made the remark about you working at the CONAC booth because I met you in the hall in the building where the meetings where held, and you came up to me and apologized for missing
one of our meetings (either the NCSG one or the NCUC one, I cannot remember) because you were working with your colleagues and could not get away. Then you returned to the CONAC booth. Was I incorrect in assuming that your day job was interrupting your volunteer
activities at NCUC? If so, please tell me, I am happy to be corrected.</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p><span style="font-size:13.5pt; font-family:"Lucida Grande",serif; color:black">I did not interrogate you at the time on it, and I am not going to do it now. The question is a simple one, when you attend ICANN meetings, are you working for CONAC? Are you
on salary? On what basis are you participating at ICANN? are you on a leave of absence, is this considered professional development for your work etc.? This whole episode in my view reinforces a point I have been attempting to raise for years at ICANN:
we need more transparency about what our members are doing at ICANN. Who do they purport to represent, who are they actually working for? No, this does not mean that consultants have to release their client lists, the commercial sector seem to manage this
quite well and we need to do the same.</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p><span style="font-size:13.5pt; font-family:"Lucida Grande",serif; color:black">As an example, when I started at ICANN in the EWG, I was still working for the Canadian government. I took personal leave for every day that I worked at ICANN meetings. That
soon added up to weeks of leave spent at ICANN meetings. I had to file a fairly detailed conflict of interest statement, and I never represented the views of the government. If you are on salary for an organization (a company, a government, etc) I think
some kind of explanation as to how you are not representing that organization in your ICANN activities is required. However, I understand that my views are at the extreme end of some of the views held by our constituents.</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span></p>
<p><span style="font-size:13.5pt; font-family:"Lucida Grande",serif; color:black">In the meantime, I think it is a great pity that this is really the first communication I have had from you in at least a year. We were supposed to be working on the RDS, and
I looked forward to helping you understand the EWG report more fully. I remain happy to do that. Let us get on with the work here, folks.</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span></p>
<p><span style="font-size:13.5pt; font-family:"Lucida Grande",serif; color:black">Kind regards, Stephanie Perrin</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">On 2017-04-21 09:34, Peter Green wrote:</span></p>
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<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">(Dear Folks,</span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">I did see there were several comments coming in regarding my Statement. </span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">I would like to respond one by one, piece by piece.)</span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">Dear Stephanie,</span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">Thanks for your comment. </span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">I do hope "it seems pretty clear to [you]". </span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">Pertaining to what you have added, you saw me "on duty at the CONAC booth while attending Marrakech" (ICANN 55, held in March 2016 in Morocco)?</span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">Is this clear to you?</span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">Are you sure?</span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">It was quite possible that I sat down with my computer at a booth (or at whatever booth) during intervals of intensive sessions during an ICANN public meeting. I assume anybody may sit down at
a booth during an ICANN public meeting, if he/she needs to have a rest.</span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">But I have no idea how you came to that conclusion just based on your "visual impression"?</span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">Are you sure there was a CONAC booth in ICANN 55-Marrakech?</span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">What I can provide is let the evidence speak:</span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">1. Thank You to Sponsors of ICANN 55 Meeting</span></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">The Board wishes to thank the following sponsors: Verisign, Inc., Nominet UK, NCC Group, PDR Solutions FZC, China Internet Network Information Center (CNNIC), Public Interest
Registry, CentralNic, Afilias plc, Radix FZC, Rightside, dotistanbul, fmai, .MA and Office National Des Aeroports.</span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span><a href="https://www.icann.org/resources/board-material/resolutions-2016-03-10-en#1.i" id="LPlnk791385" previewremoved="true"><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">https://www.icann.org/resources/board-material/resolutions-2016-03-10-en#1.i</span></a><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span></p>
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<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">2. </span><a href="https://meetings.icann.org/en/sponsorship" id="LPlnk749244" previewremoved="true"><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">https://meetings.icann.org/en/sponsorship</span></a><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-top:15.0pt"><a href="https://meetings.icann.org/en/sponsorship" target="_blank"><span style="font-size:16.0pt; text-decoration:none">Sponsorship Opportunities | ICANN Public Meetings</span></a></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-top:15.0pt; line-height:10.5pt"><span style="font-size:10.5pt; color:#666666">meetings.icann.org</span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-top:15.0pt; line-height:15.0pt"><span style="font-size:10.5pt; color:#666666">ICANN Public Meetings are one of the largest international conferences of the online world with over 2000 participants from 150 countries around
the globe.</span></p>
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<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">FYI, to have a booth in an ICANN public meeting, organizations have to be sponsors.</span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">So, Stephanie, are you sure there was a CONAC booth in ICANN 55 and you saw me on duty at the booth?</span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">To make this fact clear, I woud like to have your reply on this point.</span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">Thank you!</span></p>
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<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">Best</span></p>
<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">Peter</span></p>
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<p><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Microsoft JhengHei",sans-serif; color:black">发件人</span></b><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">
Ncuc-discuss </span><a href="mailto:ncuc-discuss-bounces@lists.ncuc.org"><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><ncuc-discuss-bounces@lists.ncuc.org></span></a><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">
</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"MS Gothic"; color:black">代表</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> Stephanie Perrin
</span><a href="mailto:stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca"><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca></span></a><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"><br>
</span><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Microsoft JhengHei",sans-serif; color:black">发送时间</span></b><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">
2017</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"MS Gothic"; color:black">年</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">4</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"MS Gothic"; color:black">月</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">19</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"MS Gothic"; color:black">日</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">
0:57<br>
</span><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"MS Gothic"; color:black">收件人</span></b><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">
</span><a href="mailto:ncuc-discuss@lists.ncuc.org"><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">ncuc-discuss@lists.ncuc.org</span></a><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"><br>
</span><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"MS Gothic"; color:black">主</span></b><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Microsoft JhengHei",sans-serif; color:black">题</span></b><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">
Re: [NCUC-DISCUSS] Statement from Zuan Zhang (Peter Green) Complaint to Ombudsman</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">
</span></p>
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<p><span style="font-size:13.5pt; font-family:"Lucida Grande",serif; color:black">It seems pretty clear to me. I would add that Peter was on duty at the CONAC booth while attending Marakech. This is nothing personal, it is just important that we keep things
clear and stick to the rules.</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p><span style="font-size:13.5pt; font-family:"Lucida Grande",serif; color:black">Kind regards, Stephanie Perrin</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">On 2017-04-18 12:08, Remmy Nweke wrote:</span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">James thanks for further efforts.
</span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">Like you said this issue should come to a close.</span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">With the aforesaid evidence there is nothing more to add.</span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">Regards</span></p>
</div>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">Remmy</span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">On 18 Apr 2017 16:26, "James Gannon" <</span><a href="mailto:james@cyberinvasion.net"><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">james@cyberinvasion.net</span></a><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">>
wrote:</span></p>
<blockquote style="border:none; border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt; padding:0in 0in 0in 6.0pt; margin-left:4.8pt; margin-top:5.0pt; margin-right:0in; margin-bottom:5.0pt">
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<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">In the interests of transparency I need to out myself as one of the initial complainants, Peter was clearly operating within ICANN as a representative
of CONAC representing a registry and not as stated </span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">“My organization CONAC is a member of RySG and two colleagues of mine are serving as representatives of CONAC in RySG. I was not listed
as a representative of CONAC in RySG at that time. The only fact is I am staff of CONAC”</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in"><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">This can be verified by visiting
</span><a href="https://community.icann.org/display/S1SF/Drafting+Team#DraftingTeam-CompositionandAttendance" target="_blank"><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">https://community.icann.org/display/S1SF/Drafting+Team#DraftingTeam-CompositionandAttendance</span></a><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">
where one will find,</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">“</span><span style="font-size:10.5pt; font-family:"Arial",sans-serif; color:#333333; background:white">Zuan Zhang - China Organizational Name Administration
Center (CONAC)”</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:10.5pt; font-family:"Arial",sans-serif; color:#333333; background:white"> </span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:10.5pt; font-family:"Arial",sans-serif; color:#333333; background:white">listed under registries. Additionally this team was closed to all but contracted parties and the GAC as confirmed to me by Fabien from
ICANN staff.</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:10.5pt; font-family:"Arial",sans-serif; color:#333333; background:white"> </span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="m-4991330741890849142msoplaintext" style="margin-left:.5in"><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">On 01/09/2015, 17:07, "Fabien Betremieux" <</span><a href="mailto:fabien.betremieux@icann.org" target="_blank"><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">fabien.betremieux@icann.org</span></a><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">>
wrote:</span></p>
<p class="m-4991330741890849142msoplaintext" style="margin-left:.5in"><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span></p>
<p class="m-4991330741890849142msoplaintext" style="margin-left:.5in"><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">>Hello James,</span></p>
<p class="m-4991330741890849142msoplaintext" style="margin-left:.5in"><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">> </span></p>
<p class="m-4991330741890849142msoplaintext" style="margin-left:.5in"><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">>Members of the Framework Drafting Team are either representatives of
</span></p>
<p class="m-4991330741890849142msoplaintext" style="margin-left:.5in"><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">>Registry Operator, Registrars or Governments (GAC/PSWG). We don¹t have
</span></p>
<p class="m-4991330741890849142msoplaintext" style="margin-left:.5in"><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">>a specific observer status for other members of the community at this
</span></p>
<p class="m-4991330741890849142msoplaintext" style="margin-left:.5in"><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">>point of our developments (which started only recently).</span></p>
<p class="m-4991330741890849142msoplaintext" style="margin-left:.5in"><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">> </span></p>
<p class="m-4991330741890849142msoplaintext" style="margin-left:.5in"><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">>However, all developments of the Drafting Team are public. You will
</span></p>
<p class="m-4991330741890849142msoplaintext" style="margin-left:.5in"><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">>find all available information on this workspace:</span></p>
<p class="m-4991330741890849142msoplaintext" style="margin-left:.5in"><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">></span><a href="https://community.icann.org/display/S1SF/Spec+11+Security+Framework+Hom" target="_blank"><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">https://community.icann.org/display/S1SF/Spec+11+Security+Framework+Hom</span></a><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="m-4991330741890849142msoplaintext" style="margin-left:.5in"><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">>e</span></p>
<p class="m-4991330741890849142msoplaintext" style="margin-left:.5in"><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">> </span></p>
<p class="m-4991330741890849142msoplaintext" style="margin-left:.5in"><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">>Let me know if you need any additional information.</span></p>
<p class="m-4991330741890849142msoplaintext" style="margin-left:.5in"><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">> </span></p>
<p class="m-4991330741890849142msoplaintext" style="margin-left:.5in"><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">>Best Regards</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">So as a complainant to the former EC on this matter it is clear that one cannot represent one stakeholder group on the EC while actively participating
as part of the RySG on closed ICANN policy processes. This is the clear difference vs Rafik for example. Also I will note Farzi serves as the formal NCUC liaison to the PIR advisory council, a position that comes with NCUC membership so I am not clear how
an NCUC position could be considered in conflict with the NCUC?</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">The former EC took the correct action here and has acted in a professional and integral manner, pointing out clearly the conflict of interest and asking
Peter to resign which he did. I hope that everyone can agree that this situation almost 1 year on should be left to close now with Peter confirming that going forward he will be representing the RySG.</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">Regards,</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">James</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
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<div style="border:none; border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt; padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> Ncuc-discuss [mailto:</span><a href="mailto:ncuc-discuss-bounces@lists.ncuc.org" target="_blank"><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">ncuc-discuss-bounces@lists.ncuc.org</span></a><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Herb Waye<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, April 12, 2017 11:47 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> </span><a href="mailto:ncuc-discuss@lists.ncuc.org" target="_blank"><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">ncuc-discuss@lists.ncuc.org</span></a><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"><br>
<b>Cc:</b> ombudsman <</span><a href="mailto:ombudsman@icann.org" target="_blank"><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">ombudsman@icann.org</span></a><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [NCUC-DISCUSS] Statement from Zuan Zhang (Peter Green) Complaint to Ombudsman</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">Please find below a statement from Zuan Zhang (Peter Green). Attached is the initial request for his resignation and his response. This statement is
in response to the statement posted by the former NCUC EC on April 10, 2017. </span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">Herb Waye</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">ICANN Ombudsman</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><a href="https://www.icann.org/ombudsman" target="_blank"><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">https://www.icann.org/ombudsman</span></a><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><a href="https://www.facebook.com/ICANNOmbudsman" target="_blank"><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">https://www.facebook.com/ICANNOmbudsman</span></a><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">Twitter: @IcannOmbudsman</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">ICANN Expected Standards of Behavior:</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><a href="https://www.icann.org/en/system/files/files/expected-standards-15sep16-en.pdf" target="_blank"><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">https://www.icann.org/en/system/files/files/expected-standards-15sep16-en.pdf</span></a><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">Community Anti-Harassment Policy</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><a href="https://www.icann.org/resources/pages/community-anti-harassment-policy-2017-03-24-en" target="_blank"><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">https://www.icann.org/resources/pages/community-anti-harassment-policy-2017-03-24-en</span></a><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">Confidentiality</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">All matters brought before the Ombudsman shall be treated as confidential. The Ombudsman shall also take all reasonable steps necessary to preserve
the privacy of, and to avoid harm to, those parties not involved in the complaint being investigated by the Ombudsman.The Ombudsman shall only make inquiries about, or advise staff or Board members of the existence and identity of, a complainant in order to
further the resolution of the complaint. The Ombudsman shall take all reasonable steps necessary to ensure that if staff and Board members are made aware of the existence and identity of a complainant, they agree to maintain the confidential nature of such
information, except as necessary to further the resolution of a complaint</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">Comments from Zuan Zhang (Peter Green) on Former EC's Statement</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">Dear NCUCers,</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">From August, 2016 to April, 2017, it’s been 8 months since I took the case of the former NCUC EC’s decision to ask me to resign from office to the ICANN
Ombudsman.</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">Time to speak.</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">I assume it is better to put all of the things on the table and would like to have the whole picture for our NCUC members to see the core of the case,
the nature of the case.</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">On 1<sup>st</sup>, August, 2016, I received a letter (please see the attached Email 1) from the former NCUC EC asking me to resign. In the letter, the
EC came to the conclusions that I was not eligible to be a NCUC member, I am a member of the Registries Stakeholder Group (RySG) and I actively participated in the work of RySG. Therefore, the EC decided to remove me from the office.</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">I replied to the former EC acknowledging my receipt of the letter. Then I was silent for a few days and went back to hometown for family affairs. When
I returned to work, there were discussions going on in the NCUC mailing list. I found that there were divergent views on my eligibility of being a NCUC member among many of our NCUC veterans, therefore I decided to take this case to the ICANN Ombudsman and
I made it very clear that before the Ombudsman’s decision, I would not take any action, hence long time silence (please see the attached Email 2).</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">However, I could not imagine that the case had been going on for so long. There were several rounds of discussions among me, the Ombudsman and the former
EC until Rafik published the former EC’s Statement on Monday. </span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">After rounds of discussions, the former EC did not agree with some views of the Ombudsman. Therefore, the former EC released this Statement to clarify
their action.</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">Below are my comments on the former EC’s Statement:</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">1. Issue of My Eligibility of Being a NCUC Member.</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">I could not understand how the former EC had ever come to the conclusion that I was not eligible to be an NCUC member. I joined in NCSG/NCUC in March,
2013 as an individual member with registered domain names (one of them was expired, currently holding an IDN domain name</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:SimSun; color:black">钻</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">.</span><span style="font-family:"MS Gothic"; color:black">我</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:SimSun; color:black">爱</span><span style="font-family:"MS Gothic"; color:black">你</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">,
xn--h84a.xn--6qq986b3xl)for non-commercial self-use in accordance with NCSG Charter and NCUC Bylaws. I could not see how I am not eligible to be an individual member of NCUC. However, the former EC claimed that I am a member of RySG. For your information,
RySG only consists of organizational members—registries. My organization CONAC is a member of RySG and two colleagues of mine are serving as representatives of CONAC in RySG. I was not listed as a representative of CONAC in RySG at that time. The only fact
is I am staff of CONAC. Does the fact that I am staff of CONAC and CONAC is a member of RySG mean that I am a member of RySG? That’s clearly not the case in accordance with the RySG Charter. If it is not that case, I could not see why the former EC came to
such a conclusion according to the NCUC Bylaws, if not with a preconceived notion that staff of a registry could be not individual members of NCUC, however, the NCUC Bylaws does not say so.</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">On the other hand, in the Statement the former EC also mentioned that “[the former EC’s] request for Peter to resign from the EC was not caused by any
misconduct or poor performance on his part”, “[the former EC’s] main concern has always been the integrity of the NCUC”, “[t]his is designed to prevent commercial or contracted parties from attempting to control or influence [NCUC] Constituency”. I do agree
with maintaining the integrity of NCUC. If the former EC’s decision to remove me was not due to my misconduct rather due to my relationship with CONAC and CONAC’s relationship with RySG, there are two other facts that deserve attention. Rafik now works for
NTT Communications, a business company in Japan and Farzaneh is serving as a member on the Advisory Council of .org registry—PIR—a registry. According to the circumstances of my case, in order to preserve the integrity of NCUC and prevent commercial or contracted
parties from controlling NCUC, does it mean that the NCUC EC should consider removing them from office due to their relationship either with a business company or with a registry, both of which are not committed to non-commercial interests.</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">2. Authority Issue</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">It should be noted that the CURRENT EFFECTIVE NCUC Bylaws does not encompass terms or articles regarding removing an incumbent EC member, as it was mentioned
in the former EC’s Statement that “there was no precedent in NCUC’s history for the EC to draw upon”. Therefore, the former EC’s action to remove me from office was not on basis of the NCUC Bylaws. There is a gap in the NCUC Bylaws.</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">It is just owing to my case that NCUC found there is gap hence necessity to include removing an incumbent EC member in the revised NCUC Bylaws, see email
on 14<sup>th</sup>, October, 2016 at </span><a href="https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__lists.ncuc.org_pipermail_ncuc-2Ddiscuss_2016-2DOctober_019237.html&d=DwMGaQ&c=FmY1u3PJp6wrcrwll3mSVzgfkbPSS6sJms7xcl4I5cM&r=kIm7BGIl3qR3NKOfU-SwstwQr15K9OhllVGUWu0k8uc&m=kfPRSa6Hq7XVjsBTD1dYGMxfK7l5VIP7CJMsnltDDZw&s=9ClgqJhulZz6yY_JHgaWzghAeK0GuQZ9nwJwIfi4OKY&e=" target="_blank"><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">http://lists.ncuc.org/pipermail/ncuc-discuss/2016-October/019237.html[lists.ncuc.org]</span></a><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">,
however, in his comment on the former EC’s Statement, Professor Milton Mueller claimed that “[t]he approval of the new bylaws validates the actions of the EC by making it unambiguous that the NCUC has the right to remove from office people who are not eligible.”
Would you mind differentiating the relationship between cause and effect? Which is first? My case was before the former EC’s intention to include terms of removing an incumbent EC member in the new NCUC Bylaws. Professor Milton is talking about the effect
of the approval of the revised Bylaws. It seems Professor is talking about the other side of the coin. Unfortunately, two sides of a coin never meet each other. I hope any effective discussion should be on the same side of the coin.</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">3. Transparency Issue.</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">The former EC sent me a letter asking me to resign and claimed that it was an EC decision. Were there any EC meetings or records? I was removed only
due to email exchanges between members of the former EC, without documentation. Weren’t there transparency issues? In this sense, it seemed that I was removed in a non-transparent way with non-legitimate EC authority (at the time the NCUC bylaws was not revised,
even if the NCUC bylaws was revised, it is not effective now).</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">With my comments, I aim to have the whole picture on the table for the NCUC members. I would not say the case is moot or not. All of us could comment.</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">More importantly, I see that my case has helped eliminate ambiguities and gaps of the NCUC Bylaws, though it severely affected my work in NCSG/NCUC.</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">Community integrity is important. Legitimacy and transparency is also important.</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">Thank you all!</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">Best Regards</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">Zuan Zhang (Peter Green)</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"> </span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">(Note:</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">1. I would like to reiterate that I have no intention to participate in NCSG/NCUC because of the effect on me and I will unsubscribe from the NCSG/NCUC
mailing list on 1<sup>st</sup>, May 2017. </span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style=""><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black">2. Due to the effect of the case on me, after 8 months, in late March, I asked to join RySG and was listed as an alternate representative (without voting
rights) of CONAC in RySG to start my ICANN journey. As I am still in this case, I have reported my action to the Ombudsman for record.)</span><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
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Ncuc-discuss mailing list<br>
</span><a href="mailto:Ncuc-discuss@lists.ncuc.org"><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Ncuc-discuss@lists.ncuc.org</span></a><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"><br>
</span><a href="http://lists.ncuc.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/ncuc-discuss" target="_blank"><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">http://lists.ncuc.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/ncuc-discuss</span></a><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif; color:black"></span></p>
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<pre><span style="color:black">_______________________________________________</span></pre>
<pre><span style="color:black">Ncuc-discuss mailing list</span></pre>
<pre><a href="mailto:Ncuc-discuss@lists.ncuc.org">Ncuc-discuss@lists.ncuc.org</a><span style="color:black"></span></pre>
<pre><a href="http://lists.ncuc.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/ncuc-discuss">http://lists.ncuc.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/ncuc-discuss</a><span style="color:black"></span></pre>
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