<html><head></head><body><div style="color:#000; background-color:#fff; font-family:HelveticaNeue-Light, Helvetica Neue Light, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif;font-size:13px"><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1448397633956_23939"><span id="yui_3_16_0_1_1448397633956_23869">+1. When it comes to elections and ballot, bylaws should do. <br></span></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1448397633956_24022"><span id="yui_3_16_0_1_1448397633956_23869"><br></span></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1448397633956_24019"><span id="yui_3_16_0_1_1448397633956_23869"><br></span></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1448397633956_24014"><span id="yui_3_16_0_1_1448397633956_23869">Best, <br></span></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1448397633956_24017"><span id="yui_3_16_0_1_1448397633956_23869"><br></span></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1448397633956_24054"><span id="yui_3_16_0_1_1448397633956_23869"><br></span></div><br> <div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1448397633956_23831" style="font-family: HelveticaNeue-Light, Helvetica Neue Light, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif; font-size: 13px;"> <div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1448397633956_23830" style="font-family: HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif; font-size: 16px;"> <div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1448397633956_23829" dir="ltr"> <hr size="1"> <font id="yui_3_16_0_1_1448397633956_23828" size="2" face="Arial"> <b><span style="font-weight:bold;">From:</span></b> "Mueller, Milton L" <milton@gatech.edu><br> <b><span style="font-weight: bold;">To:</span></b> Tapani Tarvainen <tapani.tarvainen@effi.org>; "ncuc-discuss@lists.ncuc.org" <ncuc-discuss@lists.ncuc.org> <br> <b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Sent:</span></b> Tuesday, November 24, 2015 10:15 PM<br> <b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Subject:</span></b> Re: [NCUC-DISCUSS] NCUC EC Elections - Voting Starts tomorrow 23 Nov 2015<br> </font> </div> <div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1448397633956_23832" class="y_msg_container"><br>I would favor going with the bylaws, especially if it is easy for Maryam to change. <br clear="none">The 4-2-1 formula was meant to differentiate between large and small organizations, and individuals. 2-1-1 doesn't distinguish between large and small organizations, which may or may not be the right thing to do, but if the bylaws say 2-1-1 we should try to follow them. <br clear="none"><br clear="none">--MM<br clear="none"><br clear="none">> -----Original Message-----<br clear="none">> From: Ncuc-discuss [mailto:<a shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:ncuc-discuss-bounces@lists.ncuc.org" href="mailto:ncuc-discuss-bounces@lists.ncuc.org">ncuc-discuss-bounces@lists.ncuc.org</a>] On Behalf<br clear="none">> Of Tapani Tarvainen<br clear="none">> Sent: Tuesday, November 24, 2015 3:52 AM<br clear="none">> To: <a shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:ncuc-discuss@lists.ncuc.org" href="mailto:ncuc-discuss@lists.ncuc.org">ncuc-discuss@lists.ncuc.org</a><br clear="none">> Subject: Re: [NCUC-DISCUSS] NCUC EC Elections - Voting Starts tomorrow 23<br clear="none">> Nov 2015<br clear="none">> <br clear="none">> Hi Bill,<br clear="none">> <br clear="none">> Without digging into email archives, my recollection is that in 2013 I first<br clear="none">> made the voter list using 2-1-1 weights as per our bylaws, but you decided to<br clear="none">> use 4-2-1 instead on grounds of consistency with NCSG and precedent<br clear="none">> (apparently it had been done that way previously), so I redid the list that way,<br clear="none">> Chair being in charge of elections it was your call. I don't remember how<br clear="none">> extensively that was discussed among the entire EC, but I do recall suggesting<br clear="none">> bylaws change to align NCUC and NCSG weightings.<br clear="none">> <br clear="none">> In 2014 I was not in the EC but I'm pretty sure 4-2-1 weighing was used then as<br clear="none">> well. I seem to recall showing Maryam how to use the script I wrote for the<br clear="none">> purpose; looking at it now I see it hasn't been changed since December 2013,<br clear="none">> and it uses the 4-2-1 weighing (the code for 2-1-1 alternative is present but<br clear="none">> commented out).<br clear="none">> <br clear="none">> So, history and consistency with NCSG favours 4-2-1, bylaws say 2-1-1.<br clear="none">> <br clear="none">> The bylaws also say that<br clear="none">> <br clear="none">> "The Chair shall also: [...] Establish ballots for voting, for review by the EC"<br clear="none">> <br clear="none">> and<br clear="none">> <br clear="none">> "The Executive Committee shall have the following duties: [...] Approve all<br clear="none">> ballots for online elections"<br clear="none">> <br clear="none">> So, over to you and NCUC EC.<br clear="none">> <br clear="none">> Technically changing the weights in the list is trivial (I think Maryam could do<br clear="none">> it in about 15 seconds), if that's what you decide.<br clear="none">> This is not a technical problem but a political decision.<br clear="none">> <br clear="none">> Tapani<br clear="none">> <br clear="none">> On Nov 23 12:56, William Drake (<a shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:william.drake@uzh.ch" href="mailto:william.drake@uzh.ch">william.drake@uzh.ch</a>) wrote:<br clear="none">> <br clear="none">> > Hi Ed<br clear="none">> ><br clear="none">> > > On Nov 23, 2015, at 12:10 AM, Edward Morris <<a shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:egmorris1@toast.net" href="mailto:egmorris1@toast.net">egmorris1@toast.net</a>><br clear="none">> wrote:<br clear="none">> > ><br clear="none">> > ><br clear="none">> > > So rather than the 4-2-1 voting proportions used for NCSG elections,<br clear="none">> NCUC elections are run using a 2-1-1 vote weighing system. In practical terms<br clear="none">> the NCUC Bylaws give more power to individual members, the NCSG Charter<br clear="none">> to large organisations.<br clear="none">> > ><br clear="none">> > > I do hope the tabulation software will be programmed to accurately reflect<br clear="none">> the NCUC Bylaws. We have several contested elections with some fine<br clear="none">> candidates and in fairness to them it would be good to use the vote weighing<br clear="none">> system contained in our Bylaws and not that of our SG.<br clear="none">> > ><br clear="none">> ><br clear="none">> > This puzzled me so I checked with Glen and Maryam as well as the 2013 and<br clear="none">> 2014 final vote tallies I have saved on my computer. As far as we can see,<br clear="none">> what we’ve done for some years now is follow the NCSG Charter's vote<br clear="none">> weighting rather than the NCUC Bylaws' weighting, which was defined prior<br clear="none">> the SG's formation. You were on the NCUC EC when we did this in the 2013<br clear="none">> election and I don’t recall it being an issue. There’s obviously an argument for<br clear="none">> having harmonization with the later and technically higher level model, no?<br clear="none">> Why should we change direction at this point?<br clear="none">> ><br clear="none">> > Unfortunately, Tapani (king of the data base) is off line today, so maybe<br clear="none">> we’ll hold off a day on sending out ballots until we can hear from him. I’m<br clear="none">> about to get off a bouncy train in Zurich where I teach for four hours, and in<br clear="none">> any event have never touched the data base, so I’d rather make sure that our<br clear="none">> understanding fits with his.<br clear="none">> ><br clear="none">> > Best<br clear="none">> ><br clear="none">> > Bill<br clear="none">> ><br clear="none">> _______________________________________________<br clear="none">> Ncuc-discuss mailing list<br clear="none">> <a shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:Ncuc-discuss@lists.ncuc.org" href="mailto:Ncuc-discuss@lists.ncuc.org">Ncuc-discuss@lists.ncuc.org</a><br clear="none">> <a shape="rect" href="http://lists.ncuc.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/ncuc-discuss" target="_blank">http://lists.ncuc.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/ncuc-discuss</a><div class="qtdSeparateBR"><br><br></div><div class="yqt3675441208" id="yqtfd55972"><br clear="none">_______________________________________________<br clear="none">Ncuc-discuss mailing list<br clear="none"><a shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:Ncuc-discuss@lists.ncuc.org" href="mailto:Ncuc-discuss@lists.ncuc.org">Ncuc-discuss@lists.ncuc.org</a><br clear="none"><a shape="rect" href="http://lists.ncuc.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/ncuc-discuss" target="_blank">http://lists.ncuc.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/ncuc-discuss</a><br clear="none"></div><br><br></div> </div> </div></div></body></html>